Buying Geronimo's bow & arrows: The Frazier court case

Deb, with all due respect to your background, as I only know what the CJ has reported about the case...but, Betty Markwell is the one who testified that she and Webb were out to get the Salisburys. With today's story that Frazier was parsing words, having selective memory, admitted that he expected Salisbury to make some commission $, wrote off considerably more for tax purposes, etc., it makes one wonder:

1) Why did this even go to trial if it all appears to be blowing up on Frazier so easily?

2) If the IRS is paying attention at all, Frazier is going to be in a heap of trouble.

3) I hope the museum itself and its non-profit status is not affected adversely by this.

very good points Michael. I am wondering is there wasn't some trouble brewing with the IRS related to the way the prices on these weapons were being artificially inflated, so the Salisbury issue was created as a diversion.

It does appear like an attempt (so far, seemingly sadly ambitious) at a smokescreen by Frazier. The fact alone that he wrote off enough for taxes to reduce millions (was it 5 or 6 in interest alone?) down to 300K for tax purposes looks to be fairly telling.

I agree Michael, I only hope the Museum doesn't suffer because of all this. It's one of my favorite museums and it would be a shame if it winds up paying the price for all this unfiltered greed, regardless of whose greed it gets chalked up to.

I agree Michael, I only hope the Museum doesn't suffer because of all this. It's one of my favorite museums and it would be a shame if it winds up paying the price for all this unfiltered greed, regardless of whose greed it gets chalked up to.

I think that is the key point that is lost in all the finger pointing.

Michael,

Betty Markwell is the one who testified that she and Webb were out to get the Salisburys

The article is no longer available except by purchasing it (and I'm not paying Gannett). but my memory of what Betty said is very different. I'm pretty sure she said that she and Ed Webb started an private investigation of the Salisbury's because they were concerned about suspicuous activity. (Which as employee and CFO they should do, particularly with a non-profit org). She also admitted that she hated the Salisbury's and was afriad for her job. The defense attorney was the one who said Betty and Ed were out to get the Salisbury's.

If you'd ever met Betty, you'd know how ridiculous this idea is: she's the archetypal sweet older secretary whose absolute loyalty to OBF would force her to investigate anyone she thought might be taking advantage of her boss- especially since he was in very poor health at the time.

I'm not suggesting OBF was absolutely in the clear or do I have knowledge of what OBF did with his tax returns, but it wouldn't surprise at all if he took full advantage of the tax laws. But I truly beieve that the Salisbury's and Wilson colluded to defraud OBF and the Museum.

As for M. Salisbury: If the commisions were legit , then why didn't he report them? (so much for the honesty and integrity of the Executive Director of a non-profit) IRS seems to think he owes over $500K in taxes on income that was not reported....

Deb

I agree Michael, I only hope the Museum doesn't suffer because of all this. It's one of my favorite museums and it would be a shame if it winds up paying the price for all this unfiltered greed, regardless of whose greed it gets chalked up to.

I have mixed feelings about the place. It's very well done and obviously they spent a boatload of money developng it. But, the fact that it celebrates the myriad of ways humans have found to kill each other disturbs me - maybe that's the point(?)

They're seeking a kindler, gentler image with the change from "Arms Museum" to "International History Museum". We went to the photographic exhibit of former US presidents, and we enjoyed that. Now, they're featuring the "Home for the Holidays" works of Norman Rockwell. Considering the museum's theme, that's a little incongruous isn't it?

Well, I hope we don't start ignoring some history because it makes us uncomfortable. All history is important to know, in my judgment. And knowing what caused previous conflicts to occur, as well as how conflicts shaped and reshaped countries and peoples is worthwhile information. I'm someone who very much wants a peaceful world, but I honestly don't see how we can really get there unless and until most people can understand humankind's violent past. Repeating history's mistakes essentially happens because of ignorance of history.

Well, I hope we don't start ignoring some history because it makes us uncomfortable. All history is important to know, in my judgment. And knowing what caused previous conflicts to occur, as well as how conflicts shaped and reshaped countries and peoples is worthwhile information. I'm someone who very much wants a peaceful world, but I honestly don't see how we can really get there unless and until most people can understand humankind's violent past. Repeating history's mistakes essentially happens because of ignorance of history.

Do you think that sentiment is what motivated Mr. Frazier to collect arms and to open the museum?

i have no idea what his intentions were and frankly don't care. I agree with Steve and think that the museum offers us an excellent opportunity to self evaluate ourselves as human beings and learn from our mistakes. It's doubtful that as imperfect humans we will ever escape the waging of war. I submit however that the wars that were fought in our earlier years of existence did more to stave off additional wars then what we are doing now. War from a distance where we push a button and faceless people are just gone doesn't remind us of the ugliness of what war really is. To learn peace, understand the horrors of war.

Well, I hope we don't start ignoring some history because it makes us uncomfortable. All history is important to know, in my judgment. And knowing what caused previous conflicts to occur, as well as how conflicts shaped and reshaped countries and peoples is worthwhile information. I'm someone who very much wants a peaceful world, but I honestly don't see how we can really get there unless and until most people can understand humankind's violent past. Repeating history's mistakes essentially happens because of ignorance of history.

Do you think that sentiment is what motivated Mr. Frazier to collect arms and to open the museum?

nope. I think he loves guns.

For those of us who worked on the original concept and Master Plan for the exhibits, it was very much about the history and the "learning from past mistakes". But Ron is correct, OBF's driving vision was that he loves guns (and appreciates their history and beauty).

Deb

Having dropped the C-J months ago, will someone please tell me how this case ended? Thanks.

Having dropped the C-J months ago, will someone please tell me how this case ended? Thanks.

Still going on, Ed - the defense started presenting its case today.

Having dropped the C-J months ago, will someone please tell me how this case ended? Thanks.

Still going on, Ed - the defense started presenting its case today.

Thanks, TP. Must have been a heck of a recess for the holidays?