Off-topic discussions about regional news, issues and politics. Pretty much everything goes here, but keep it polite: Flaming and spamming aren't welcome.
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Suzi Bernert

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Re: Leaked Gannett document outlines CJ paywall

by Suzi Bernert » Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:42 am

BYE BYE!!!
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Ed Vermillion

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Re: Leaked Gannett document outlines CJ paywall

by Ed Vermillion » Sat Jan 14, 2012 12:59 am

I trace it back much further, specifically to February 14, 1987. The Valentines Day massacre of The Louisville Times. In that one fell swoop

fell
adj.
1. Of an inhumanly cruel nature; fierce: fell hordes.
2. Capable of destroying; lethal: a fell blow.
3. Dire; sinister: by some fell chance.
4. Scots Sharp and biting.

I knew all I needed to know about the future of our media in Louisville. I grew up on reading the C-J in the morning knowing that any interesting story would be followed up on and completed, by the Times staff. We had such fine journalism here that built the base for publications nationwide. The C-J & Times were standard bearers for excellent locally based journalsim. Print media explored both sides of a story and it seemed that both publications competed to find the answers to any story.

I've based my journalistic standards on the reporting of those days. It's gone and I still pine for the fjords.

Your vitriol is understandable on different levels, Robin. Like grieving for the dead it works its way out in its own time. I don't think mine will end in this lifetime.
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RichardM

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Re: Leaked Gannett document outlines CJ paywall

by RichardM » Sat Jan 14, 2012 10:38 am

Suzi Bernert wrote:BYE BYE!!!



Well I guess that answered my question about when we are giving it up.

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Robin Garr

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Re: Leaked Gannett document outlines CJ paywall

by Robin Garr » Sat Jan 14, 2012 5:30 pm

Ed Vermillion wrote:I trace it back much further, specifically to February 14, 1987. The Valentines Day massacre of The Louisville Times. In that one fell swoop

From the inside, Ed, that was more of a Terry Schiavo situation. They finally pulled the plug on that day, and it was a sad moment when The Louisville Times nameplate disappeared for sure. But it had been in a vegetative state for a couple of years before that, when they merged the news staffs and turned The Times into essentially an afternoon edition of the CJ wit a new flag hoisted but no change in the content.
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Brian Curl

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Re: Leaked Gannett document outlines CJ paywall

by Brian Curl » Wed Jan 18, 2012 10:56 pm

Robin Garr wrote:Stockholder mentality. Everything is about short-term profits, even if the ship is steaming inexorably toward the rocks.


I guess capitalism is a bad thing. I guess something like this could be better:

The Socialist Party's view
Socialism in the Twenty-First Century - the Way Forward for Anti-Capitalism, by Hannah Sell, is the best introduction to the ideas of socialism today.

Here Hannah, writing in 2002, outlines the ideas explained in her book:


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

"FOR MOST of human history it has not been possible to satisfy even the most basic human needs. Now, as a result of the labour and ingenuity of working people, the potential exists to eliminate want forever.

The barrier to achieving this is the capitalist system itself. Based as it is on the private ownership of the productive forces (factories, offices, science and technique), capitalism creates immense inequality and deprivation when the potential exists for providing the material components of a decent life for all.

Capitalism is driven by big business' need to make the maximum possible profits. A socialist society, by contrast, would be driven by the need to provide a decent life for all humanity, whilst protecting the environment for future generations.

http://www.socialistparty.org.uk/faq.php?question=socialistcountries#3
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Robin Garr

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Re: Leaked Gannett document outlines CJ paywall

by Robin Garr » Thu Jan 19, 2012 2:41 pm

Brian Curl wrote:
Robin Garr wrote:Stockholder mentality. Everything is about short-term profits, even if the ship is steaming inexorably toward the rocks.


I guess capitalism is a bad thing. I guess something like this could be better:

The Socialist Party's view

There is almost nothing more pitiful than a really stupid person who thinks he's smart.
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Re: Leaked Gannett document outlines CJ paywall

by Brian Curl » Fri Jan 20, 2012 12:02 am

Robin, an 8yr old must have got on your Chinese made ipad will you were taking a break eating granola and called me dumb. His mother should have taught him better.
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Jackie R.

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Re: Leaked Gannett document outlines CJ paywall

by Jackie R. » Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:27 am

Damn it, Brian. When will you tire of being an internet troll on this site? Two days without you and I hoped we were done. Your motives are so f#%king obvious to this avid reader, and they are clearly to ire the moderator. Be done with it, or I can assist.
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Brian Curl

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Re: Leaked Gannett document outlines CJ paywall

by Brian Curl » Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:03 pm

Brian's Post - questioning a statement on "short term profits" and "stock holder mentality" --- what are companies supposed to do?

Robin's Post - Brian's dumb

Brian's Post - Calling people dumb is 8yr old mentality

Jackie's Post - Brian's a troll

Sorry Jackie, I don't see the logic.
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Mike Hardin

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Re: Leaked Gannett document outlines CJ paywall

by Mike Hardin » Fri Jan 20, 2012 1:15 pm

Brian, you threw out "socialist" as if it were an insult to bait Robin into replying. You got the reply you wanted so you could play the victim. It's pathetic and it's trolling. You don't add anything here. Please go away.
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Adam Robinson

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Re: Leaked Gannett document outlines CJ paywall

by Adam Robinson » Tue Mar 20, 2012 1:23 am

On the plus side, were there any logical reason to want to read the Courier Journal online, I've yet to see a paywall news site on the internet that couldn't be circumvented with a minimal amount of knowledge or a simple Google search.

Then again, I'm fairly certain no one is going to bother trying to get through to their website anyway.
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Adam Robinson

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Re: Leaked Gannett document outlines CJ paywall

by Adam Robinson » Tue Mar 20, 2012 1:28 am

Brian Curl wrote:
Robin Garr wrote:Stockholder mentality. Everything is about short-term profits, even if the ship is steaming inexorably toward the rocks.


I guess capitalism is a bad thing. I guess something like this could be better:


You know that capitalism existed before the modern trading architecture and enshrinement of corporations as people obligated solely to their shareholders' short-term interests, right?

I know spending time getting degrees in these areas probably makes me one of those effete cognoscenti who cares about how words and concepts are important and mean things, but the binary reaction of, "If not current distorted capitalism, therefore Socialism!!11!!111!" is at the very best a sign of someone who doesn't even understand what either Capitalism or Socialism are. Or, at the worst, in fact, a troll.
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Carla G

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Re: Leaked Gannett document outlines CJ paywall

by Carla G » Wed Mar 21, 2012 8:28 am

Very few of ANY newspapers' profits come from the actual selling of the paper. By far the vast majority of a newspapers' earnings are from the advertising revenue. Given that, newspapers should be thrilled to see readers' habits change to online media. CJ (or any other newspaper) could switch their formate to a website, still sell advertising, and save the GIGANTIC cost of ink, paper, printing, housing and delivering a hard copy paper. CJ's and other Gannet newspapers revenues are down because their advertising sales are melting away. Why? After talking with many many former newspaper advertisers it is because of the shoddy customer service they received after purchasing their advertising. A rotating door of salesmen and the handing off of accounts to unpaid interns with no emotional or financial investment in the client has cost them (as well as other newspapers that practice the same slip shod sidestep) a huge chunk of their advertising base. While saying that the Internet has cost them readers may sound reasonable on the surface, most advertising sales people will tell you that few advertisers REALLY compare exposure numbers or even know how to. (With the exception of marketing companies and a few adept business owners.)
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John Greenup

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Re: Leaked Gannett document outlines CJ paywall

by John Greenup » Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:17 pm

On some days, issues of the C-J are so thin, I can literally fold the newspaper twice, and place it in my pocket - pathetic.

The proliferation of cable and internet news sources have outpaced newspapers in terms of providing timely stories...IMO, hard-copy newspapers, like the C-J, should focus more on news analysis, de-emphasizing the "Who/What/When/Where", and delve into the "Why"...and while they're at it, lose some of those lame comics.
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Robin Garr

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Re: Leaked Gannett document outlines CJ paywall

by Robin Garr » Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:53 pm

John Greenup wrote:IMO, hard-copy newspapers, like the C-J, should focus more on news analysis, de-emphasizing the "Who/What/When/Where", and delve into the "Why"..

That was the theory back in the '70s, John, but the enemy then was television news. The evening news quickly killed afternoon dailies, including The Louisville Times, but when the Internet started to grow, it was deja vu all over again. Look at how late The CJ came to the Web, and how poorly it did so - even, arguably, to this day. They didn't believe TV news was a threat ("so brief! So superficial!") until it ate their lunch; and the same thing happened with the Internet.
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