Corporations??

It seems the majority of the members of this forum are very anti-corporation. The latest victim to get trashed is 21c Hotel. Would anyone care to give their views on what Louisville would be like without all of the jobs, tax base ,ect that large companies pump in to this community. I know for a fact that many of our LOCAL and beloved independent restaurants have ties to corporate money i.e. investors. Does everyone think that the great dining scene has evolved here because all of the chef/owners are independantly wealthy? Any takers? What would the Louisville cityscape look like without Ford, UPS, Humana and GE just to name a few?

Good point/question.

The lovely bride and I find ourselves at New Direction (Hwy146/Gene Snyder) two or three times a month. When Ford is building, they're pouring...when Ford is down to one shift, not so much.

[Robin Garr]

As originator of the 21c complaint, I'd make the point that I wasn't trashing 21c, I was trashing Walmart. I'm a selective corporation-basher: I understand that they are a necessary part of the free market system. Heck, I HAVE a corporation! It brings you LouisvilleHotBytes and other good things.

But I do believe that in the 1990s-2000s, as at the turn of the previous century, we've been through a period of uncontrolled corporate power verging on fascism. I'm troubled by the power of megacorporations on the international scale, and on the fiction of the corporate person as most recently spelled out by Roberts, Scalia et all.

Just as I like people but think they need a system of laws to keep them in line, I think so, only more so, about corporations. Let 'em run. Rein 'em in. And ensure that they properly protect the needs of their workers, their consumers and the environment. Untrammeled corporatism: Bad. Regulated capitalism in a democratic society, fine.

Adding to what Robin said...
I'm not necessarily opposed to big corporations. There are some out there that are very conscientious in regard to their community and society in general. It used to be when a big business (like a steel industry or a shoe factory or a mill) went into a town they literally built the town. They provided good jobs with fair (just) pay and were an integral part of the community they were in. They partnered with the town and all benefited. People actually RETIRED from the business and maybe even drew a pension.

There seems lately however, to be a rash of corporations or big businesses that do not act so responsibly. They don't partner with the town, they partner with select individuals in power and USE the town and its population. And while they continue to make hugh profits, many pay their employees a paltry income. Many deny health benefits by simply employing all or mostly part time help. Ever ridden through coal mining towns like Big Stone Gap or any other little towns in Appalachia? The business owns EVERYTHING, controls the price of everything from gas to a dozen eggs. They control the schools and health care facilities . And they act not with the good of the community in mind but rather the bottom line. They never run out of warm bodies because someone always needs a job.

It seems now that "big business"= "big bully" . They frequently act as if they are above the law simply because of their size or perceived importance.

Yeah, there are small, independent businesses out there that also act selfishly but they fade away because of their bad business practices. Unfortunately big corps have more financial padding and can operate on a smaller bottom line because of their volume. They hang around and continue to just grind through help.

I wish those days of responsible partnership with communities were still here but I fear they are a thing of the past.

In support of Carla's statement, I grew up in North Canton Ohio - "The Home of The Hoover Company". Throughout most of my life the company was the text book example of a good corporate neighbor. They provided jobs...jobs with a pension and they donated to the community on many levels, In return they had a loyal and dedicated workforce. THEN in 1989 the company was purchased by Maytag and the sh** started rolling down hill...Maytag was eventually acquired by Whirlpool and things went further south. The final kiss of death was when Maytag sold out to (China based) Techtronic Industries in 2006. The company ? For all practical purposes...Gone. People a year or two or three away from a pention...out of work and SCREWED out of their retirement...This in a community where there are NO jobs for 40 or 50 year old middle class working people.

I realize it is something of an elementary gut level response (and a bit off topic) but in my little mind a lot of this crap is the result of Tricky Dicky Nixon and Ronald Reagan and their efforts to bring China out of the dark ages. Same thing with applies with Clinton (etc, etc) and NAFTA...If we'd have left China to manufacturing imitation trinkets and Mexico to sewing cheap leather goods we wouldn't be nearly as bad off today.

Oh, boy. I've waded into this pool too many times on hotbytes. I don't have the energy to be the capitalist that responds to every anti-big business post. All I'll say here (and I'll really try to stay away from this thread going forward) is that prior to deciding big business is bad, take a look at the elements of your life that are made better by some degree of globalization and the benefits of a well-functioning set of large businesses from which you benefit. I love small and local (heck, I just got back from Taste of Asia for lunch), but to act like we're going to use the products and services created by so many of the mega-companies and then bash them later is inconsistent. And FWIW, I started my career at (gasp) Merrill Lynch, moved downstream to Hilliard Lyons, and them moved way downstream to my current firm (which is truly a locally owned small business).

take a look at the elements of your life that are made better by some degree of globalization and the benefits of a well-functioning set of large businesses from which you benefit...but to act like we're going to use the products and services created by so many of the mega-companies and then bash them later is inconsistent.

T.P.

Don't get me wrong...this is not one of my "hot buttons" and I acknowledge the arguments for both sides but I honestly think that even in the best light possible this whole "globalized" economy thing is a mixed bag. Can I go to Wally World and buy a Chinese made vacuum cleaner for cheap ? Yep, sure can...but at what cost in terms of jobs in my former local economy ? One could make that comparison across as many industries as you care to name. I'm not saying I don't buy foreign or that I don't buy "big" but I certainly factor in any corporate shenanigans I happen to be aware of when making my buying decisions. Not ranting...just saying.

Don't get me wrong...this is not one of my "hot buttons" and I acknowledge the arguments for both sides but I honestly think that even in the best light possible this whole "globalized" economy thing is a mixed bag. Can I go to Wally World and buy a Chinese made vacuum cleaner for cheap ? Yep, sure can...but at what cost in terms of jobs in my former local economy ? One could make that comparison across as many industries as you care to name. I'm not saying I don't buy foreign or that I don't buy "big" but I certainly factor in any corporate shenanigans I happen to be aware of when making my buying decisions. Not ranting...just saying.

I think we all should make good decisions based on what we believe is appropriate. I'm all cool with that. I just think we are all customers of corporate, global America (and China) companies and it's really disingenuous to think we can avoid it at this point. Not saying it's right or wrong: everyone sorts through that on their own.

Perhaps it's like most things, you become more aware of the problems when the problems become your own (or those of someone for which you care ). Until then its a great deal easier to say "Hey, just look on the positive side."

I realize there is give and take on almost any situation but seriously, can't you see how "big business" (for lack of a better name) has earned their own bad rap?

I just think we are all customers of corporate, global America (and China) companies and it's really disingenuous to think we can avoid it at this point.

Individuals can avoid or at least limit the amount of money that they spend on products & services that are provided by businesses (large & small) that they don't like (for whatever reason). It's very similar to politics (spending your money is like voting). I agree that it's difficult to halt or slow this beast that we've allowed to flourish at this point but it's not impossible. However, I don't think it'll ever happen w/o some serious campaign finance reform & most politicians (Democrats & Republicans) aren't currently willing to give up those bribes (many of them do a good job at pretending though). I personally think that much of this is a cultural problem (e.g: encouraging greed). Why do people that make millions want to expand beyond their city, county, state, region or even country? I think that for the most part the answer is quite clear (there are obviously a few exceptions).

Well, there are a lot of things not to like about corporations. But instead of going on about them, I'll direct you to a well-researched and well-thought-out documentary on the subject.

It is called "Corporation," and is available free (wow!) to you on youtube in 23 chapters. Yes, the movie's website actually directs you to youtube. (you can also rent it at Wild N Wooly or your fave video shop).

Chapter 1: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pin8fbdG ... PL&index=0
The movie: http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p ... C214A6CE87
The website: http://www.thecorporation.com/index.cfm?page_id=46

One of my problems with corporations is that they have been granted the rights of individuals. However, they don't behave morally like individuals. In fact, it is their fiduciary responsibility to their shareholders to maximize profits. So while they share the rights of people, they often act in an "inhuman" manner. Thus, I don't feel they deserve the rights that our courts have granted them. I personally think they're "out of control," excessively powerful, and a detriment to society.

Anyway, check out the movie. It is really good!

This film http://growthbusters.org/find-out-more/about-the-film/ deals with the whole issue. Our growth, fueled by corporations, is killing us. Here in Louisville, we have three visions of the future: the corporate vision of Cordish, 4th St. Live., the local, entrepreneurial spirit of NuLu, and and the old, organic, independent liveliness of Bardstown Rd. The latter two give us real, sustainable hope. The first one, which our mayor and and the two candidates for mayor support, is glitzy and appealing, but, as the film shows, ultimately destructive, as mountaintop removal has been, as agribusiness has been, as the automotive industry and their products have been, as the banking industry has been...

All that said, it would be naive to argue that, in such a complex world, we could live without big businesses. And a lot can be said for the ways we benefit from smart, conscientious, creative, idiosyncratic rich people. Much of the best of Louisville, including NuLu, comes from the investments, ideas, and developments of such people. I'm no communist. I just believe that scaling back, controlling, limiting, watching the movements of multinational corporations is necessary if we want to survive.

The Story of Stuff does a nice job highlighting the problems of corporatism, consumerism, and globalization in twenty minutes or so.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Se12y9hSOM0