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Kevin Graves

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Re: In Defense of Suburban Dining

by Kevin Graves » Sun May 18, 2008 11:18 pm

No problem. I think I will stick to just posting about the food, itself, from now on.
Kevin J. Graves
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Roger A. Baylor

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Re: In Defense of Suburban Dining

by Roger A. Baylor » Sun May 18, 2008 11:50 pm

Almost forgotten in all this is this telling statement by the article's author:

"There’s no question that America’s collective tastes are evolving; new flavors are continually filtering into the suburbs from urban and ethnic centers ... "

So it goes; Americans flee from the source of artistic and culinary inspiration, then look to it after convenient sanitizing by a handy corporate entity. The author goes on to write:

"We’re stuck with them, so the two factions will just have to get along."

That's where I disagree, but perhaps being in the business of selling good beer has jaded me, seeing as good beer purveyors must fight against the mentality of the mass-market beer faction (i.e., our own "fellow" beer makers) as much as we must defend our interests against prohibitionists. "Getting along" is marvelous, so long as compromise is equally shared.

But jeez, who am I to argue with the likes of corporate shills like Guy Fieri?
Roger A. Baylor
Beer Director at Pints&union (New Albany)
Digital Editor at Food & Dining Magazine
New Albany, Indiana
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robert szappanos

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Re: In Defense of Suburban Dining

by robert szappanos » Mon May 19, 2008 6:21 am

Your welcome...Robin...
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carla griffin

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Re: In Defense of Suburban Dining

by carla griffin » Mon May 19, 2008 6:46 am

Perhaps I should apologize for my participation in this thread. As Roger stated, we got away from what the original post was. My original comments were directed at marketing efforts. Whether or not you're a chain or IR, you MUST understand the group you're marketing to or you stand little chance of succeeding. (How can I give you what you want if I don't know what you really want?) It was my monkey wrench that started the hole mess by saying I thought every IR would read the article posted. (Perhaps I should have said, "every business person" instead.) Somehow we got a wee bit off track. If my passion for marketing came across as combativeness I do apologize.
Hey how 'bout that Big Brown!
Carla
There is one thing more exasperating than a wife who can cook and won't, and that's a wife who can't cook and will. ~Robert Frost
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Robin Garr

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Re: In Defense of Suburban Dining

by Robin Garr » Mon May 19, 2008 7:32 am

Kevin Graves wrote:No problem. I think I will stick to just posting about the food, itself, from now on.

You didn't do anything to apologize for, Kevin. Intelligent debate is very much on point for this forum.
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Robin Garr

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Re: In Defense of Suburban Dining

by Robin Garr » Mon May 19, 2008 7:33 am

carla griffin wrote:Perhaps I should apologize for my participation in this thread.

No way, Carla! As I told Kevin, the discussion has been useful and interesting. Nothing to apologize for!
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Andrew Mellman

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by Andrew Mellman » Tue May 20, 2008 3:51 am

carla griffin wrote:Perhaps I should apologize for my participation in this thread. As Roger stated, we got away from what the original post was. My original comments were directed at marketing efforts. Whether or not you're a chain or IR, you MUST understand the group you're marketing to or you stand little chance of succeeding. (How can I give you what you want if I don't know what you really want?)


Over the years, I've done a LOT of customer research for chains from Arby's to Papa John's and others. These people spend extremely big bucks at the individual market level researching customer tastes . . . for example, when Arby's came out with their deli sandwiches, I ran a mid-five figure study just in Chicago to see how the deli line compared to all other Chicago sandwich places (locals and competitive chains within 1 mile of an Arby's). The sandwiches were adjusted slightly for the Chicago market as a result of the study.

I had a friend (in another city) who was opening a BBQ restaurant. I asked him about researching what people wanted, whether they liked his Q. I explained that BBQ is very regional, with some areas liking wet, some dry, some vinegary, some sweet, et al. I told him that one needn't spend a lot of money, but even informal tastings of recipes among friends could give him more of a feel of what his potential customers wanted.

He did not test; he felt that - since his was "best" - people would flock to his place. He lasted 15 months before closing.

In other words, I'm totally agreeing with Carla (and justifying the business I'm in). Chains do extensive research continually, adjusting their offerings for customer appeal (and understanding what their customers want). The more successful IR do the same thing - perhaps not to the same degree, or at the same level of expense, but still go out and see what customers want and how they can continually reinvent themselves to maximize their results in their chosen market. Note that I'm NOT saying to "dumb down" for mass appeal; I'm saying one must understand the customer in one's chosen niche, no matter how small or large that customer base may be! I've seen successful IR's whose only research is continually monitoring which menu items sell at what levels, and adjusting menu's at regular intervals to focus more on the more popular areas, but even this is a form of customer monitoring! You can debrief the wait staff each night, on what questions customers asked, which menu items people debated between, what items were left on people's plate (vs those finished) and get a view of what customers want and how these wants change over time.

Good successful places do this as a matter of course; larger places augment this process with actual market research projects. Those that don't try to understand their customers tend to wonder why they are empty while the chain next door is always jammed.

A continuing vote for Carla!
Andrew Mellman
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