Quick poll: Would you dine al fresco if there's smoking?

[Robin Garr]

Related to our recent discussion on this topic, and giving me fodder for an article to come, this quick poll seeks to discern the depth of our feelings about smoking in outdoor patio, sidewalk and other alfresco dining options.

Feel free to add replies to expand on your opinions, no matter which side you're on.

This non-smoker would do it gladly, if only to spite the no-smoking nanny-state Nazis.

[Robin Garr]

spite

My sixth-grade teacher, back in the Jurassic Era, used to scorn people who would "bite off their nose to spite their face." It took me all these years to observe this phenomenon in real life. Thanks, Jeff!

This non-smoker would do it gladly, if only to spite the no-smoking nanny-state Nazis.

I'm not sure where you're going with this comment. The only person you are spiting if yourself by harming your health and limiting the enjoyment of your meal because of the smell of smoke.

The previous post was, of course, tongue-in-cheek.

Reputable studies (example) have found no statistically significant link between secondhand smoke and lung cancer - certainly not at the exposure levels involved with an occasional waft from the table next to you on an outdoor patio. I'm fine-ish with indoor smoking bans, though I wish they had reasonable exemptions for certain kinds of businesses, but banning it in the open air goes a bit far.

I can understand, too, that some people find the smell unpleasant. Sometimes I do, sometimes I don't. But I don't expect restaurants to cater to my opinions about what's environmentally unpleasant. Until restaurants start banning patrons from wearing scent or dining with excessive B.O., I object to discrimination against my fellow citizens who are smokers.

I would rather share a patio with smokers than I would families with small children...

The previous post was, of course, tongue-in-cheek.

Reputable studies (example) have found no statistically significant link between secondhand smoke and lung cancer - certainly not at the exposure levels involved with an occasional waft from the table next to you on an outdoor patio. I'm fine-ish with indoor smoking bans, though I wish they had reasonable exemptions for certain kinds of businesses, but banning it in the open air goes a bit far.

I can understand, too, that some people find the smell unpleasant. Sometimes I do, sometimes I don't. But I don't expect restaurants to cater to my opinions about what's environmentally unpleasant. Until restaurants start banning patrons from wearing scent or dining with excessive B.O., I object to discrimination against my fellow citizens who are smokers.

Unfortunately most scientific studies conclude that second hand smoke increases cancer rates..

http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/Tobacco/ETS

I would rather share a patio with smokers than I would families with small children...

THIS!!!!!

Lora S.

I would rather share a patio with smokers than I would families with small children...

I find them both extremely offensive and disturbing while trying to eat in enjoyable dinner but at least the children don't screw up my taste buds like the smoke does!

Meh. I'd rather share the patio with smokers than adult men who dine with their caps/hats on.

.

Unfortunately most scientific studies conclude that second hand smoke increases cancer rates..

http://www.cancer.gov/cancertopics/factsheet/Tobacco/ETS

Looks like a lawsuit, with each side bringing in experts!

I have to say that the studies behind the document you quoted were primarily monographs, of the type that said things like "since smokers get cancer, others who breathe second hand smoke must also get it" without the 76,000 person study referenced by Jeff.

I am a life-long non-smoker, who was intimately familiar with the research here, and there is little. The problem is, one cannot find funding for such a study! After all, if one found that second hand smoke did not cause disease, you would be politically incorrect and people would dismiss the work, while if you found that it did cause disease people would say that everyone knew that already, and your study thus was not advancing knowledge and thus would not qualify for obtaining a PhD. Sort of a catch 22.

The one very interesting study (prior to the 76,000 member study referenced) was the original study demonstreating that cigarettes are related to cancer (although specific causality has never been proven!). That looked at tens of thousands of married couples where one spouse smoked and the other did not (although they WERE subject to second hand smoke throughout). This demonstrated conclusively that there was an extremely strong correlation (not causality) between smoking and lung cancer and other diseases, as the smoking spouse was highly likely to become ill while the non-smoking spouse remained disease free!

Oh, well.

I don't like the smell, so for me it would depend on the winds and how many smokers were out there.

[Robin Garr]

Meh. I'd rather share the patio with smokers than adult men who dine with their caps/hats on.

Hey, Bill, I know of plenty of places where you can have BOTH! In fact, don't those two things often go together?

Meh. I'd rather share the patio with smokers than adult men who dine with their caps/hats on.

Hey, Bill, I know of plenty of places where you can have BOTH! In fact, don't those two things often go together?

The more I think about this the more I think men wearing "covers" indoors means they are a concealed carry permittee. As any ex-military type knows, one of the few exceptions to no head gear indoors, is if you are carrying arms. Guess that explains my aversion to this behavior.

Before my son came to be, I would have probably sucked it up and dined outdoors and tried to avoid the smokers (as if you can), but since I have my baby boy, I'd definitely take it indoors.

I grew up in a house with two heavy smoking parents. Every day I went to school smelling like a Malboro commercial and while you can cite all of the biased studies for and against that you like, I've been exposed to too much first hand experience to want to subject my child to anything remotely close to what I endured as a child. (Mother currently dying of lung cancer, father hacking and coughing for 45 minutes every morning before getting out of bed, yellow stained toys and walls) Maybe second hand smoke gives you cancer, maybe it cures erectile dysfunction, but if there is a risk it is the former and not the latter, I see no reason to risk my child's health as others destroy their own. In my simple mind, the same toxins that cause cancer in the smoker are floating around in that lovely cloud, so why do I want to breathe that in?

As far as I am concerned cigarette smoke does not belong in anyone's lungs, especially those who do not want it there.

The previous post was, of course, tongue-in-cheek.

Reputable studies (example) have found no statistically significant link between secondhand smoke and lung cancer - certainly not at the exposure levels involved with an occasional waft from the table next to you on an outdoor patio.

We're on difficult ground here. I'm a scientist and the only thing I take more seriously than science is pizza. That said, the commentary that accompanied the article you linked to said "A large body of research has linked passive smoking to lung cancer, as well as to coronary heart disease, asthma, emphysema, respiratory infections, sudden infant death syndrome, low birth weight, and childhood ear infections. According to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, secondhand smoke is responsible for 46,000 heart disease deaths and 3,400 lung cancer deaths among US nonsmoking adults each year."
This one article, while interesting, runs counter tp many other articles that have shown an association between second-hand smoke and malignancy. But, for the sake of argument, let's say that second hand smoke doesn't increase the risk of lung cancer. There is still a large body of evidence that it can trigger other serious problems like asthma or angina. That said, I'll endure the occasional waft of second-hand smoke for really great pizza.