Craving Jewish deli corned beef!

What are the hallmarks or key elements of a "true" Jewish deli?

I know Robin totally disagrees with me here (or maybe due to different upbringing doesn't understand the emotional aspect), but my fond memories include heavy meals, $20 sandwiches that are so large you think you're getting a bargain, sides of matzo ball & cabbage soup, chopped liver on the corned beef in "combo" sandwiches, stuffed kishke (sp?), two to five kinds of herring, a menu 12 pages long, and - yes - waiters who never write anything down & yell at you. (but no, the food does not have to be greasy; greasy is NOT the same thing as having enough fat remaining in it to make it taste good)

How's this: If you don't have heartburn when you leave, it's not a "true" Jewish deli?

Stevens & Stevens makes a good corned beef sandwich, but when we've eaten there it's 4-6 ounces of corned beef; it is NOT Vienna corned beef that weighs in at a pound or so. In Cleveland, in my opinion one of the best deli's is Slyman's, which in point of fact is Lebonese Christian not Jewish, but still fits the definition in most ways.

[Robin Garr]

I know Robin totally disagrees with me here (or maybe due to different upbringing doesn't understand the emotional aspect), but my fond memories ...

Andrew, I was hossin' around a little, but you're probably right about the influence of foods we know as childhood comfort food. I was exposed to Queens and the Borscht Belt as a kid (long story) and got at least a taste of Jewish deli, but except for a lifelong crush on real New York bagels (which are hard to find even in New York any more), I never developed much of an affection for deli ... Jewish or Italian, either one.

I know Robin totally disagrees with me here (or maybe due to different upbringing doesn't understand the emotional aspect), but my fond memories ...

Andrew, I was hossin' around a little, but you're probably right about the influence of foods we know as childhood comfort food. I was exposed to Queens and the Borscht Belt as a kid (long story) and got at least a taste of Jewish deli, but except for a lifelong crush on real New York bagels (which are hard to find even in New York any more), I never developed much of an affection for deli ... Jewish or Italian, either one.

I think the "childhood comfort food" goes far in food likes/dislikes and even food criticism! I know for pizza, for example, whether thick or thin crust Chicago is a sausage town, while Cleveland is mushrooms & peperoni. In Cleveland one wanted massive amounts of (fatty) deli food, even if others might actually taste better. BBQ differences by region are obvious (e.g.: mutton v beef v pork, tomato sauces v only rubs v mustard-based sauces, et al).

I didn't mean to pick on you particularly, but the emotional ties to certain foods remaining from childhood can color opinions to such a degree that rational comparisons sometimes go out the window! (and I'm more guilty of that than anyone)

We used to have several great Jewish delis in Louisville way back when. I fondly remember Charlie Simon's near Bonnycastle and several others with names I don't remember. Les Neiman had a couple here, as well as Bill (last name?) who had a great deli in a building that used to be behind WW Cousins. I think he taught at Sullivans for a while. Unfortunately, it is a lot of work for little profit.

[Robin Garr]

Les Neiman had a couple here,

Les's Nosh Box really introduced a lot of Louisvillians to Jewish deli, and he did it very well. Their Sunday brunch was outstanding! Les tried for a reprise a few years ago in a spot off Hurstbourne near Z's Oyster Bar, but for whatever reason it didn't take.

(He also posts a lot of extreme Tea Party political stuff on Facebook these days, which probably suggests that he has no plans to get back in the restaurant biz. I'm reasonably open-minded, but I probably wouldn't patronize his shop now, after having seen some of his posts. )

For all you folk who think you can only get good corned beef in a NY deli, I say "get outta here!" Arby's has concocted the "real deal" reuben sandwich that goes toe-to-toe with the deli best in NY. Who can argue with Bo Deit?

http://www.ispot.tv/ad/7Idi/arbys-reube ... outta-here

Les Neiman had a couple here,

Les tried for a reprise a few years ago in a spot off Hurstbourne near Z's Oyster Bar, but for whatever reason it didn't take.

We went and ordered a Reuben. Called Les over, as there were two slices of corned beef in it (maybe 1 oz?) and no sauerkraut. Les opened the sandwich (after moving the cash he was carrying to his other hand), said it looked like the normal amount of corned beef to him, and said that since most people don't like sauerkraut they only add it when they were asked. He motioned for a passing waitress, and told her to bring me a plate of sauerkraut, which she did. I tossed the bread he had handled, ate my two pieces of corned beef with a forkful of sauerkraut and dunked it into some dressing, and never came back.

Friends had similar experiences, with some receiving great sandwiches but more receiving skimpy flat sandwiches from surly help.

Some may laugh at the Arby's Reuben, but it was significantly better than what we got from Les that day!