Discussion of Robin Garr's Bistro 1860 review

[Robin Garr]

Bistro 1860: a paradise for foodies, just not a wine geek bar
LEO's Eats with Robin Garr



What the heck is a wine geek? A wine geek loves wine, can carry on an extended conversation about the stuff, knows a little about how it's made, and plans trips around winery visits. He rejects labels like "snob" or even "connoisseur," though, preferring to be recognized for a hobbyist's passion. She loves wine, but understands that, after all, it's really just grape juice - delicious, adult grape juice that goes great with food but is best taken in moderate doses.

For almost a decade, there was hardly a place that geeks loved more than the L&N Wine Bar & Bistro, whose owners Len ("L") Stevens and Nancy ("N") Richards offered a wine-geek experience unmatched in the city.

Notice that I said wine-geek experience. Wine connoisseurs might have been able to find more pricey bottles around town, perhaps more "trophy" bottles highly rated by the big-name critics - a measure that attracts more snobs than geeks. But only L&N put it all together, as I wrote in a 2007 LEO Weekly review: "With its majestic wall of wine, a 54-bottle Cruvinet wine-storage facility and dispenser that's the largest made, it boasts a wine program that's second to none. More than 100 wines are available for tasting ... Connoisseurs may also peruse the book-length cellar list."

But Len and Nancy gave it up after Derby last year, facing business realities when a lease and liquor license both came due for renewal following an enduring recession.

Now, after a fix-up effort that includes an eye-catching exterior paint job in mustard yellow, new owners Ron Kayrouz and Terry Fereday, with Chef Michael Crouch (previously of Bourbons Bistro), have reopened the business as Bistro 1860.

Crouch is doing a fine job with an eclectic, mostly American menu that offers most dishes in a choice of three portion sizes from "bites" through medium "apps" to full-size "plates." Diners may graze through an array of small plates, settle in for a more traditional app and entree, or something in-between. It's paradise for foodies.

For wine geeks, however, there's a little less joy, but to be fair, no one but a geek is likely to notice.


Read the full review on LouisvilleHotBytes,
http://www.louisvillehotbytes.com/bistr ... e-geek-bar

And in LEO Weekly:
http://leoweekly.com/dining/bistro-1860 ... e-geek-bar

Bistro 1860 Wine Bar & Spirits
1765 Mellwood Ave.
618-1745
http://bistro1860.com
Rating: 83

Though I've already done so privately, Nancy and I wanted to publicly thank Robin for his kind words. Your consistent support over our nearly 9 year run was greatly appreciated. We would also like to wish Ron, Terry, and Chef Crouch all the best. That space will always hold a special place in our hearts.

I enjoy your reviews however this one seems to focus a bit much on what used to be instead of what is currently there. Low score for all the raves I have been reading on here. I couldn't figure out if you gave them that score more on what that building/business used to be instead of what it is now. Shouldn't the past history not be a factor? Just my two cents. Cheers!

[Robin Garr]

I enjoy your reviews however this one seems to focus a bit much on what used to be instead of what is currently there. Low score for all the raves I have been reading on here. I couldn't figure out if you gave them that score more on what that building/business used to be instead of what it is now. Shouldn't the past history not be a factor? Just my two cents. Cheers!

Past history isn't a factor, Adam, except insofar as L&N set the standard for wine-bar inventory and service. Bistro 1860 kept the machine but significantly throttled back the wine tasting. That's worthy of attention, I think.

As for the score, 83 translates to a solid three-star, so it's hardly a slam, and I did want to keep the wording positive for a new place and a generally good experience. But I did specifically name three different issues with the food, and gently refrained from outlining some service and environmental issues that weren't fatal, but that overall added up to a good average to slightly-above-average overall experience.

I find it strange that people get disappointed with restaurant reviews. Outraged even if you consider the ridiculous fit that Steve Coomes recently threw regarding the Courier's reviews. While I'm not pointing out the two comments referencing this review in particular, they did remind me that the reader's expectations for food reviews can be fantastically different.

I've thought about this quite a bit since Robin's review of Relish came out but truthfully it has been roiling around in my head for a while now. I so enjoyed that review in particular that I sent Robin a PM telling him so. What I especially liked was the bit at the beginning where he interacts with Siri while trying to locate the restaurant. I basically read restaurant reviews for their entertainment value but I've found that most of the people I've asked about this don't.

I mentioned that review to a couple of people who I respect and who read Robin's reviews all the time and both immediately said that they had no use for the story telling narrative in the review. In fact, both made it pretty clear they would prefer “just the facts.”

My first thought was - what facts? Okay, location, hours, what's on the menu, what does it cost, who owns it, do they have wine, beer, and liquor. Do you really need a review for these facts in most cases. There's an app for that as they say. Even though the available apps leave out a lot of restaurants thus far, most restaurants worthy of review attention have a website and a Face Book presence. So why would you want someone to go a restaurant and report to you an incredibly abbreviated version of the information that can be got quicker, easier, and with more completeness yourself?

Most of a review isn't fact, its impression. It's how that particular person felt about that particular experience and as anyone who dines out with any frequency knows the variables that change each time guarantee that no two experiences will be the same. Even for the same diner going to the same restaurant, the experience is likely to be enough different that you would give it a different rating in many cases. I have found that consistency in the dinning experience is very much a scarcity.

No offense to any reviewer but I hardly ever pay much attention to what the reviewer ate or how well they liked it. It's not likely going to apply to me for my experience so what is the point? Just because they liked or didn't like it, I know that my experience will likely be different. I've had great meals in restaurants that got awful reviews and terrible meals in my own favorite restaurants.

This is the one area where fast food has a huge advantage on the “one off” restaurant where creativity is practiced and where our expectations are higher. I've never had a bad White Castle and I know exactly what the fresco grilled chicken taco at Taco Bell is going to taste like. I don't need a review for that and I will tell you that whether Robin likes the flank steak at the Silver Dollar or not is also quite irrelevant to me.

But I do wonder what does Siri think? Cheers!

I dig that you post your reviews for comment then we discuss them in a respectful manner. It's refreshing and the reason why I continue to post and read here. Thank you for clarifying stuff!

[Robin Garr]

I dig that you post ...

Thanks for getting it, Adam!

If I were an owner I would take careful notice of Robin's comments on the lack of 2 oz. wine tastings, as well as the uninspiring vegetarian options. A restaurant that specializes in wine--no 2 oz servings? and in a fine,quality cuisine--vegetarians need not apply?......... Fairly simple remedies can be applied to these basic oversights.

I headed down there this Saturday with my girlfriend for her birthday. The place was hopping after the Louisville win and had a fantastic atmosphere. Bar was exciting with the football game going, and they had lots of tables of people still enjoying their food. Our reservations where for 7:45 and with our table not quite ready Terry grabbed me and my girlfriend a drink while we waited. We watched in the bar as the game went into overtime and enjoyed the excitement going on around us.

We were seated shortly after. I was glad to see that the L&N atmospheric outside of the bar area still was still a perfect venue to sit and enjoy a meal. The ability to order bites of food was fantastic, although I might have gotten in trouble because I could not help myself in taking the last bite of the Lobster Hush Puppy.

Our server did a great job in suggesting drinks, and hinted a bit at the flights coming back when my girlfriend waffled on a wine to pick for the night. Terry later came by to talk to us a bit about why we decided to come up there for her birthday, and seemed sincerely proud that we chose their place to celebrate.

Really it was quite a cool night. As we left Terry and Chef Mike were sitting near the bar exhausted but proud. We can't wait to head back there again soon.

I just came home from a truly delicious meal at 1860, I had quite a few small bites and one app. size and evne nit-picky me could only come up with 2 tiny quibbles about any of the food. They were so slight that they are not even worth the mention.
Service was fine, but I can imagine that it could become iffy on a busy night with so many options available.
I look forward to many return visits.

No offense to any reviewer but I hardly ever pay much attention to what the reviewer ate or how well they liked it. It's not likely going to apply to me for my experience so what is the point? Just because they liked or didn't like it, I know that my experience will likely be different.

You and I disagree on this. I always pay attention to a reviewers thoughts on specific dishes, wait times, service, etc.

For example, nearly everyone I know who has eaten at La Coop has said the fried green tomatoes and remoulade sauce were both bland and tasteless. Everyone. Had I read this in a review prior to dining there I wouldnt have bothered to order them.

I tend to trust friends and reviewers impressions, until they give me reason not to trust them.

I tend to trust friends and reviewers impressions, until they give me reason not to trust them.

Friends who you've shared meals with may be able to tell you that you'd like or not like something because of your relationship with some degree of success. But how do you learn not to trust them other than to disregard them and try it yourself?

The next time I go to La Coop (which will be the first) I'll try the tomatoes. Perhaps they will have changed them based on feedback. Perhaps they will remind me of the ones I had at some point in my past and I'll appreciate them for that. How will I know unless I try them?

Cheers Doug!