My problem with the Highlands & Bardstown Road

About ten years ago I went to the large private bookstore that used to be on Shelbyville Rd. and asked for a map that would show me the areas of Louisville. I was told "No dice." If you are aware of such a map, please direct me to it.

Gayle,

You can download a free map of urban neighborhoods from Louisville/Jefferson Co. Information Consortium:

http://www.lojic.org/apps/products/cart/index.cfm

I'm sure there is probably a better one somewhere, but this is the only one I have come across online.

Google maps actually has a reasonably decent breakdown of the major neighborhoods.

google maps

great link. i never knew of all those neighborhoods even existed. irish hill? who knew.

honestly....try driving them sometime. break out your neighbor's GPS if you don't have one. You will be pleasantly surprised what you find in some areas you never heard of. Also, that link I provided, if you click the neighborhood name, it usually will have an "external link" at the bottom which links you to a specific map of the hood from Lojic.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louisville_neighborhoods

I wish Bardstown Road would be more like Nob Hill in Portland, Oregon, Mt. Adams in Cincinnati, Gas Town in San Diego, The West Village in NYC, Newberry Street in Boston, Adams Morgan in D.C., The Cow Hollow in San Francisco, Ocean Boulevard and Lincoln Road in Miami Beach, etc. I'm sure you get my drift. I know you risk becoming somewhat generic, but I do believe it would become more pedestrian friendly and charming.

My two cents....

I've lived on Mt. Adams (Fuller St.) in Cincinnati and I lived a block away from Newberry St. (Marlborough St.) in Boston. And currently, I live two blocks from Bardstown Rd. I can even see Phil's building from my window right now. Mt. Adams and the Newberry St. area are both pedestrian friendly....as long as your sole requirement in life is to visit a pub, dine in a restaurant or shop at a cute boutique. Newberry St. obviously offers more access. But on the whole most of life's needs are not within walking distance. On Mt. Adams, you even have to drive outside the area to buy a condom. Since the owner of the UDF convenience store refuses to sell them (I know TMI...sorry). I'm just making the point that the cute/charming/pedestrian friendly areas aren't reeeaally all that walkable if the definition of "walkable" is being able to do most things you'd need to do in a normal day-to-day/real-world life.

Having lived in three of Phil's examples, I prefer living in the Highlands. It may not look quite as charming, but it has its own character and provides easy access to most of life's necessities.

....Maybe I'm showing my age. Perhaps I should start this as a new post and stir up some emotion. I think I will. Phil

Speaking for myself, I took that to mean you were expecting and even soliciting differing opinions.... Not that you were soliciting applications for a cheerleading section to rah rah your own.

Am I mistaken in that?

This is by now shades of the hat "discussion" where it at first seemed to me that you were asking for our actual opinions on the topic and then appeared you were asking for opinions only if they were in concert with your own. Otherwise, if anybody had a different opinion, that opinion was indicative of some conservative failure of imagination and a misguided attachment to outdated values and mindless convention.

....to coin Crosby, Stills, and Nash, "I am older now" and get turned on by different things. If it was 1969, I probably would have loved sitting on a stoop on Bardstown Road.

I am a child of the Sixties and while in college,... I was very active politically and learned to question the establishment.

So, on the one hand, if this were the 60s, and you were younger, Bardstown Road would be just grand, and you'd probably love it. But since you're older now, you prefer something different, yes?

But what about all those folks who are young now and who like Bardstown Road for precisely the reasons you suggest you would have liked it were you younger? We should change it because you're older now and would prefer something else?

And at the same time, Phil, to set yourself up as a child of the 60s in opposition to folks here who disagree with you suggests that you're the only one on the forum who was a child of the 60s and questioning the establishment, because,... well,... I dunno, why is that again? If we disagree with you it means that we were none of us children of the 60s, that none of us has ever questioned "the establishment," and that we're all a bunch of neocons and probably... um.... conservative? republican? baptists?.... You tell me.

I feel it best that I begin to keep my opinions to myself. There are just some environments that find a difference of opinion a radical ignition to explosive dismissal. Thus, I will take on an affect reminiscent to an old Al Maguire adage, "sea shells and balloons." Everything is wonderful. I really have no thoughts about Bardstown Road, the Highlands, or Louisville. I just want a good rum and diet.

Now that I understand you, that you weren't actually asking for opinions but agreement, I shall henceforth agree with everything you say. Sort of like people say about getting along in a marriage....

So here,...

You wonder whether it's okay to wear a hat whilst dining and believe anybody who disagrees is simply hanging on to outmoded convention for the sake of convention....

You find the Highlands and Bardstown Road objectionable and nothing like Nob Hill in Portland, Oregon, Mt. Adams in Cincinnati, Gas Town in San Diego, The West Village in NYC, Newberry Street in Boston, Adams Morgan in D.C., The Cow Hollow in San Francisco, Ocean Boulevard and Lincoln Road in Miami Beach, and believe anybody who disagrees with that is just provincial and reactionary....

You find disagreement disagreeable....

So, in keeping with my new understanding of the spirit of your messages here.... Okay.... Yes dear. Whatever you say dear.

All I know is that I sure miss The White Castle On Eastern and Bardstown Rd and the interesting homeless people that hung out and drank coffee. I miss all of the "hole in the wall bars", spraypainted walls, skatepunks and the gritty scene that was in the highlands in the good ol' Reagan 80's. Coming from the burbs this was an oasis for me where I realized that I wasn't an alien afterall. And then here comes the Starbucks gentrifriednation! Ugh! Really!

Tina, I'm glad you feel that the city is walkable, and I hope you enjoy it. I disagree strongly, however.

Someone living a block or two from Bardstown can walk to a handful of restaurants, a few stores, and perhaps Kroger. Can it truly be said that you can walk to work, schools, a large selection of restaurants, specialty stores, doctors and dentists, pharmacies...in short, all the things a person might need? In New York or the D.F., I could do that, and with the addition of public transportation, I never needed a car at all.

The sidewalks are poorly maintained; people park or put their garbage cans out of the sidewalk, making it hazardous to pedestrians who have to enter the street; the commercial areas are strung out on a long corridor, so while it's technically possible to walk to anything on Bardstown, it's difficult, especially for those of us with children in tow.

When we moved here, we rented near Douglass Loop. We could walk to Kroger - the single and poor choice in groceries. We could walk to Heine Bros. or, if we hiked a bit longer, Days, and a handful of restaurants. You could not walk to a single fish market, just to give one example.

Again, I'm glad you think that the city is walkable, but I just don't see it. It would be hard indeed to live here without a car (and indeed you did say in your post that you have one) the way I did in the other places I've lived.

That being said, I have the choice of living anywhere I want; my husband and I are self-employed. I choose to live here. It's incredibly cheap - the price of our very comfortable house would buy a crappy co-op in Queens. The people are friendly. There's a good arts community. But managable without a car? I just don't see it.

I agree completely about the crappy sidewalks - and the lack thereof on a lot of streets. As you deduced, I'm fairly near Douglass Loop, but not right on top of it. I just don't mind walking. I also regularly drag my 3yo in her stroller since she finally got too big for me to sling or backpack her. Especially right now with all the debris in the sidewalks and on the streets, I find it a bit treacherous to push a stroller. However, I can in fact walk to my dentist, my pharmacy, and my son's high school. If I got super ambitious I could walk to my doctor's office (in Mid City mall) or Tarc it. But I wouldn't unless my car was in the shop, lol.

I've not lived in larger cities so I just don't notice the lack of specialty stores. I guess it's all what you're used to.

....Maybe I'm showing my age. Perhaps I should start this as a new post and stir up some emotion. I think I will. Phil

Speaking for myself, I took that to mean you were expecting and even soliciting differing opinions.... Not that you were soliciting applications for a cheerleading section to rah rah your own.

Am I mistaken in that?

This is by now shades of the hat "discussion" where it at first seemed to me that you were asking for our actual opinions on the topic and then appeared you were asking for opinions only if they were in concert with your own. Otherwise, if anybody had a different opinion, that opinion was indicative of some conservative failure of imagination and a misguided attachment to outdated values and mindless convention.

....to coin Crosby, Stills, and Nash, "I am older now" and get turned on by different things. If it was 1969, I probably would have loved sitting on a stoop on Bardstown Road.

I am a child of the Sixties and while in college,... I was very active politically and learned to question the establishment.

So, on the one hand, if this were the 60s, and you were younger, Bardstown Road would be just grand, and you'd probably love it. But since you're older now, you prefer something different, yes?

But what about all those folks who are young now and who like Bardstown Road for precisely the reasons you suggest you would have liked it were you younger? We should change it because you're older now and would prefer something else?

And at the same time, Phil, to set yourself up as a child of the 60s in opposition to folks here who disagree with you suggests that you're the only one on the forum who was a child of the 60s and questioning the establishment, because,... well,... I dunno, why is that again? If we disagree with you it means that we were none of us children of the 60s, that none of us has ever questioned "the establishment," and that we're all a bunch of neocons and probably... um.... conservative? republican? baptists?.... You tell me.

I feel it best that I begin to keep my opinions to myself. There are just some environments that find a difference of opinion a radical ignition to explosive dismissal. Thus, I will take on an affect reminiscent to an old Al Maguire adage, "sea shells and balloons." Everything is wonderful. I really have no thoughts about Bardstown Road, the Highlands, or Louisville. I just want a good rum and diet.

Now that I understand you, that you weren't actually asking for opinions but agreement, I shall henceforth agree with everything you say. Sort of like people say about getting along in a marriage....

So here,...

You wonder whether it's okay to wear a hat whilst dining and believe anybody who disagrees is simply hanging on to outmoded convention for the sake of convention....

You find the Highlands and Bardstown Road objectionable and nothing like Nob Hill in Portland, Oregon, Mt. Adams in Cincinnati, Gas Town in San Diego, The West Village in NYC, Newberry Street in Boston, Adams Morgan in D.C., The Cow Hollow in San Francisco, Ocean Boulevard and Lincoln Road in Miami Beach, and believe anybody who disagrees with that is just provincial and reactionary....

You find disagreement disagreeable....

So, in keeping with my new understanding of the spirit of your messages here.... Okay.... Yes dear. Whatever you say dear.

Couldn't have said it better. Phil's post on the last page was very rude to me, especially considering I directed him to this site. He called me provincial and arrogant out of the blue, and then put words in mouth, attributing statements to me that I never made. Also, I even offered to take him on a tour, to which he has not replied.....(in some ways, I think his vision for the city is actually a bit like mine. For example, I despise seeing the Arby's and its huge surface lot on Bardstown Road).

Two words, Phil: New Albany.

The downtown area has the geographic layout you seem to be seeking- a village-like group of blocks rather than one long stretch. If you're interested in development, it's a great opportunity as it's in the early stages of revitalization with substantial activity but still comparatively affordable. It also provides better access to downtown Louisville than many parts of Louisville proper. Running into the mayor is no problem either. He may buy you a drink.

PM me if you ever care for a guided tour and, no, I'm not a real estate agent.

thanks and apologies. cheerleading over.

I'm coming late to this discussion, having spent most waking hours the past week doing my own little bit in seeking to transform downtown New Albany into the sort of place that will elicit this many page views.

Not there yet ... but thanks to Jeff for posting the above. I'm cheerleading, too.

Here's the emotion that reading your initial "My problem ..." post stirred in me, though I've not read but a couple other bits from the four or five pages in this thread.

I'm thinking you'd be happier in another town, perhaps in Nob Hill in Portland, Oregon, Mt. Adams in Cincinnati, Gas Town in San Diego, The West Village in NYC, Newberry Street in Boston, Adams Morgan in D.C., The Cow Hollow in San Francisco, Ocean Boulevard and Lincoln Road in Miami Beach, etc.

I'm sure you get my drift.

Personally I think that Bardstown Road is extremely walkable, at least compared to the other parts of Louisville. I like the fact that the bars, restaurants, stores, and coffee shops are spread out in the way that they are. It really allows me to go to a different restaurant or coffee shop depending on where I am going to shop. When I am in Louisville for the weekends I am in a pretty good spot that allows me to go to all of my favorite spots on Bardstown road without a car (excluding great escape and Kroger which are several miles away. But we do have other similar stores closer).

And Louisville has a pretty good bus system allowing people to get to most parts of town fairly easily. I will concede that the road itself is packed on the weekends and it can be hard to find a place to park, but the situation is much worse in larger cities so Louisville isn't really something to complain about.

I concede that the auto repair places are gaudy, and I do tend to have slightly more trouble walking past them than other businesses, but it is important to have them in every neighborhood in a central location.

Maybe I just have lower expectations from living in Lebanon Junction, which has no grocery stores, one pizza place, and virtually no small shops. I have to walk two miles just to get a bottle of coke, and the majority of the town doesn't even have sidewalks.

About the walkability of the Highlands/Bardstown Road area:

When I lived in Chicago, I was fortunate that I lived in very walkable neighborhoods -- Lincoln Park (as far as Wrigleyville, etc), and then Ukrainian Village (Roscoe, etc), and I was an inveterate walker. I would venture into some iffy Chicago neighborhoods (so long as I had one of my dogs) because I love to walk. For me, the Highlands/Bardstown area is very like those Chicago neighborhoods in that regard.... Sidewalks galore, a lot of folks out walking their dogs, or folks just out walking to and fro for whatever reason. For the life of me I don't really understand the suggestion that the Highlands/Bardstown area is somehow not amenable to pedestrians. Far from it.

Exaclty, although with that said it does get annoying being hit by people riding their bikes on the sidewalk.

Truth be told even a large number of the areas of town with big box stores have better sidewalks and are more accessible than in many other smaller and mid sized cities.

Truth be told even a large number of the areas of town with big box stores have better sidewalks and are more accessible than in many other smaller and mid sized cities.

You may thank the local zoning code for the sidewalks. For many new developments/projects they are required.

Well, at least here's a discussion about something other than wearing hats indoors, for crying out loud.

C. Devlin nailed it (and Phil).