McCafe - McDonalds

[Robin Garr]

Thanks to others for reinforcing the purpose of my "over-the-top" yapping. As no one referred to my speciI can only assume the tone of both John and Robin was the "good" kind of snarky.

No, actually, I didn't care for it much. I thought my comments made that clear. I simply said it didn't reach the level where I thought it was time to raise hell, because I do allow a fair amount of latitude here in the hope the group will be civil by consensus rather than by force.

Your welcome Nimbus. It took me a while to visit your place but I have been in 3-4 times now and really enjoy your coffee. I am a big Cumberland Brews fan also so that area has turned into a cool little beer and coffee hangout, always folks out front there. I didn't get to try the espresso brew that you partnered with Cumberland with last year but I hope it comes back and I won't miss it again.

I also have enjoy Quills new spot a few times now. I'd say Ray's and Quills are my favorites on B'town road now. Heine Bros is becoming the Mcd's of B'town Road so I stay away from them

Brian,
Just got the Cumberland Ray's Espresso Stout in today on tap....maybe I'll post a head's up in a separate thread (I suspect most people aren't reading this MdD's one anymore..heehee)....
Cheers,

Nimbus

[Robin Garr]

I'm not sure what ultra-pasteurized is. But the organic we get is pasteurized, homogenized, just like any other milk you'd typically find in a grocery store. It seems to work just fine for steaming, etc. It can be a little tougher to steam at times (we're talking creating good microfoam here, and sufficient foam for a cappuccino), but a good barista can pull it off ..noooooo problem In fact, because it is all I work with, I think I'd just find non-organic milk to be easier. This is my "norm."

Nimbus, I can't explain the technology without looking it up (super-high heat?), but "ultra-pasteurized" is the treatment routinely given to most whipping cream sold in groceries. It dramatically increases its shelf-life before opening, from weeks to months, but it does change the flavor. The brand of organic milk that I got at Rainbow Blossom at the time (a few years ago, Horizon, maybe) was ultra-pasteurized, and the distinctive flavor became much more pronounced with foaming. Probably not relevant to the milk you use.

I believe most coffee shops are a rip-off; their product is horrible; and people are suckers for paying $6.00 to drink one cup of coffee. But,hey, as long as it's healthy. Right?

Can't let that comment go without comment.

I don't know if MOST are a rip-off. Where do you get that impression from? Maybe you're simply going to the wrong coffee shops. It is a free market, and the consumer is able to do a bit of research, talk to friends, get advice, look at web forums, etc. If you randomly go to a coffeeshop and expect it to be a good deal, you may be disappointed. But I really don't think that most are a rip off.

Look at the numbers. Most coffee shops don't take in that much money per day. Customers come in and may spend only two dollars or three dollars. That isn't much. Look at overhead. Rent, electricity, water, insurance, taxes, equipment costs, cost of goods sold (including cups, sleeves, and lids). The list goes on and on. But when you add it up, the margins are pretty thin. So you're talking small ticket averages, and not that great margins. If is it such a rip off, why do I know so many coffee shops that have gone under?

Further, six bucks for a cup of coffee? Where? Not at my place. Just about nowhere in town. You can get a great cup of coffee for $1.75 at Ray's. Highest price on my board is $4.67. Sure you can keep adding extra shots and extra syrups and run the price as high as you want, but that isn't normal.

Six bucks is an exaggeration. And as with most things, you get what you pay for. If you want the "non-rip-off $1.39 Speedway "cappuccino"" then go right ahead and go for it. You can feel like you've gotten a good deal. But if you want hand-crafted quality coffee, then you should be willing to pay a decent price in order to sustain the people that are working hard to bring you that cup of coffee. If not, then you're a cheapskate. (or you just don't care about quality - but you haven't been "ripped off.")

Think about it

I'll be honest, I've tried 2 of the McCafe products. I've had the carmel iced coffee and the Mccafe iced mocha. I liked the carmel drink, but wasn't a big fan of the mocha. I found it to be very bitter..more so than any mocha I've ever had. It actually made my stomach hurt afterwards. 2 of my coworkers couldn't drink theirs because of the bitterness. I happen to be a Starbucks foo foo drink consumer for the most part. But I live WAY out on the east end, and work on the east end, and there really aren't that many options out here (so don't shoot me!) We do have a Java Brewing Co., but when Christian Academy is in session it's a bear to get in and out of it. But when I go to Starbucks, I know the product I'm getting. I'm a huge Chai latte fan, and have had several that were sickly sweet. I really didn't find the price of the drinks at McDonalds to be THAT great. Yeah, I got a huge quantity, but I can't drink that much at one time..I'm a tall drink kind of girl. That's my 2 cents.

Really? Are my Southern

Thanks to others for reinforcing the purpose of my "over-the-top" yapping. As no one referred to my specifiI can only assume the tone of both John and Robin was the "good" kind of snarky.

No, actually, I didn't care for it much. I thought my comments made that clear. I simply said it didn't reach the level where I thought it was time to raise hell, because I do allow a fair amount of latitude here in the hope the group will be civil by consensus rather than by force.

Aren't we joking about how comments aren't clear on the 'net? Hi Robin, I read your response stating your notice of the edge of a sharp conversation. I believed you initiated the use of the popular word snarky. Perhaps what wasn't so clear to me was the intent of characterizing my unhappiness to a recent trend in topic discussions that could be addressed, or ignored. *shrugs* Characterizing it as yapping from under a porch. Not sure what was unclear in that.

Or why my choice to ask for (peace, manners, wasn't it?) has to conform your threshold as forum administer. Or why my quote was so mangled as to make another good comeback without addressing the specifics I offered. Ah, but, here I am, probably missing the entire good intentions through the mismanagement of the faceless internet. So, I will take your comments in stride, look up the LHB meaning of raising hell, another unnecessary characterization of my behavior, that differs from the raising hell of my Texas relatives, and find a middle ground.

You are right, we should police ourselves. And it ain't my job to do it. But when I ask for peace, after back and forth in one thread, and reference specific examples of other recent threads that don't even need to be mentioned, don't question the validity of my statement without addressing the points in my statement. Don't insult my statement or it's validity with callous turns of phrases. And use my name, at least Phil got that.

And let me know when I qualify as a voice that could be part of a "consensus" you speak of. A consensus that likes to talk about food, not what or who is worthy to talk about it. I could quote a recent back and forth, in which one injured party claimed, "you owe me an apology, buddy" but all that is owed to anyone, facing you or over the net, is respect. "Authentic" respect. Since we both like food I'll camp on that middle ground a while, but I think I have a right to say if something is ridonk. And we've had a lot of ridonk lately.

I can only assume the tone of both John and Robin was the "good" kind of snarky.

While I cant speak for Robin....Im all about the good snarky.

And now that I am clear about that, I'll come snark next to you John.

Arguing over the internet, while a wonderful evening can still await. I'm Reagan, Crazy Cat Lady, or, if you prefer (trying to instill light, playful tone), I'm Doug, and I'm outta he-r-r-e.

I'll be honest, I've tried 2 of the McCafe products. I've had the carmel iced coffee and the Mccafe iced mocha. I liked the carmel drink, but wasn't a big fan of the mocha. I found it to be very bitter..more so than any mocha I've ever had. It actually made my stomach hurt afterwards. 2 of my coworkers couldn't drink theirs because of the bitterness. I happen to be a Starbucks foo foo drink consumer for the most part. But I live WAY out on the east end, and work on the east end, and there really aren't that many options out here (so don't shoot me!) We do have a Java Brewing Co., but when Christian Academy is in session it's a bear to get in and out of it. But when I go to Starbucks, I know the product I'm getting. I'm a huge Chai latte fan, and have had several that were sickly sweet. I really didn't find the price of the drinks at McDonalds to be THAT great. Yeah, I got a huge quantity, but I can't drink that much at one time..I'm a tall drink kind of girl. That's my 2 cents.

Megan,
Is a "tall drink" Starbucks code speak? If so, I think it means "small" in normal English language.

At Ray's, we have Small, Medium, and Large.

When people say "tall" I usually (just knowing the English language fairly well) think of something that is big. But in Starbucks-land, it refers to my small size (12 oz). Very confusing. I guess they figured it adds to the mystique. I think it worked for them for several years.

Not bashing Starbucks. I just feel like I need a translator sometimes when customers come in and think they can order using Starbucks terms. Overall, Starbucks has helped the specialty coffee industry incredibly much in this country...

Cheers....

I'm not sure what ultra-pasteurized is. But the organic we get is pasteurized, homogenized, just like any other milk you'd typically find in a grocery store. It seems to work just fine for steaming, etc. It can be a little tougher to steam at times (we're talking creating good microfoam here, and sufficient foam for a cappuccino), but a good barista can pull it off ..noooooo problem In fact, because it is all I work with, I think I'd just find non-organic milk to be easier. This is my "norm."

Nimbus, I can't explain the technology without looking it up (super-high heat?), but "ultra-pasteurized" is the treatment routinely given to most whipping cream sold in groceries. It dramatically increases its shelf-life before opening, from weeks to months, but it does change the flavor. The brand of organic milk that I got at Rainbow Blossom at the time (a few years ago, Horizon, maybe) was ultra-pasteurized, and the distinctive flavor became much more pronounced with foaming. Probably not relevant to the milk you use.

Science Digest did an article on this about 8-9 months ago. It was my understanding that ultra-pasteurized milk is processed at much higher temperatures than regular milk and, as Robin mentions, extends the shelf life because it kills more bacteria. It also "carmelizes' some of the milk's natural sugars which is what gives it it's distinctive flavor. I can see how additional extreme heat would affect the flavor even more. Isn't all milk in France ultra-pasteurized because I seem to remember it being sold un-refrigerated on store shelves there?

"At Ray's, we have Small, Medium, and Large."



Let me offer you a sincere THANK YOU for this common sense! When one has to learn "the code" for ordering a cup of coffee it adds another layer of irritation to what should be a simple transaction. But hey, that may be me. I may be the only person grouchy in the morning.

Perhaps what wasn't so clear to me was the intent of characterizing my unhappiness to a recent trend in topic discussions that could be addressed, or ignored. *shrugs* Characterizing it as yapping from under a porch. Not sure what was unclear in that.

Probably should let this go,but....I think you misinterpreted Robins post. As I read it he was referring to himself "yapping"....making light of his somewhat easy going moderating style. I didint take it as anything towards you.

You are right, we should police ourselves. And it ain't my job to do it. .

I dont mean to pick apart your post( I know my grammar and spelling leave much to be desired) but I couldnt let this go. How could it not be your job?

Again Im not looking to pick a fight with you. Ill be a the BBC Tap Room tonight from 6:30 to around 8. If your in the area(clay and main) stop by and Ill buy you a brew,no charge for snarky comments either. Just ask Rob(the bartender who looks like Glenn Hughes from the Village people) who the food geek is,and he will point you my way.

SItting here drinking my tea, bc the office coffee is so... well, it was made here by our local guys but tastes like donkey do... so I haven't had my caffeine yet (and the Portland McDs is so close ).

As to my grammar, I was merely stating that while I was unhappy with the Recent Trend in Conversations that Must Not Be Named; I was not claiming to be the ultimate authority in this. As in "my job" . Which I am not doing right now.

As to the direction of the phrases "over the top, yapping from under the porch, and raising hell", I say tomato, you say tomato. Like someone said about porn recently... I know rude when I see it, and I cry rude. I wouldn't be in a live conversation where I was quoted and my statements commented on that way, not sure how the technology of the internet grants a different license. So, I go from commenting on snark, to defending myself and my grammar. Or I go to enjoy the lovely day and sneak out for some real coffee...

Or John, I'll meet you now for that brew.

And now, back to coffee...

Anybody have any good recommendations for coffee (good, to hell with authentic) in the West West End? I ain't even gonna wish for my old granita latte bliss, but I may push and ask if anyone knows of a good iced coffee down here as well.

Something actually has been lost in all this, and that's the fact (a) that if I were a believer, I'd say that one should drink espresso as God intended it -- straight, black, and minus all the foo-foo that gets added to it by McD, Starbucks or any locally owned shop, and (b) if you must pollute straight espresso, it remains that the quality of the ensuing coffee cocktail still depends on the quality of the espresso itself.

What the hell is a mocha, anyway?

(back to washing my windows)

But if you want hand-crafted quality coffee, then you should be willing to pay a decent price in order to sustain the people that are working hard to bring you that cup of coffee. If not, then you're a cheapskate. (or you just don't care about quality - but you haven't been "ripped off.")

I'll continue being a patron of Coffee Shops worth my time. Perhaps,I'll try yours one day, if I can scrounge up enough money in my couch.

Speaking of coffee, anyone know of a good Coffee Beer?

[Robin Garr]

And let me know when I qualify as a voice that could be part of a "consensus" you speak of. A consensus that likes to talk about food, not what or who is worthy to talk about it.

As a regular participant here, you already do!

Keeping it short, keeping it simple, keeping it easy to understand ...