RUMOR - DUI Checkpoint in St. Matts Tonight (07/09)

Alcoholics have a choice, people with a true disability (epilepsy) do not.

Actually, Gary's point was that if alcoholism is a mental illness, alcoholics don't have a true choice. (No, this does not excuse drunk driving. But it helps to explain why seemingly simple measures don't make people quit.)

You can't rehabilitate yourself out of a disability. Even with extensive physical therapy, a quadriplegic ain't getting up and walking anytime soon. I know several recovering alcoholics. With therapy, guess what? They are fully functioning adults who don't drink, let alone drive drunk. Alcoholism isn't a disability, it's an excuse for making poor choices.

Alcoholics have a choice, people with a true disability (epilepsy) do not.

Actually, Gary's point was that if alcoholism is a mental illness, alcoholics don't have a true choice. (No, this does not excuse drunk driving. But it helps to explain why seemingly simple measures don't make people quit.)

Don't have a choice? I'm not buying that; they were not born alcoholics. I know 3 people that have had multiply DUI's that are not alcoholics. As others have stated, drinking to a .08-.1 BAC is damn easy to do. I'm sure there are tons of people driving while legally drunk, who feel just fine. I'm probably one of them. I'm really curious what my BAC is after 2 Hoptimus; I bet I'm pushing the limit, but I drive home. These are the people getting hit for DUI's, not the alcoholics that drive straight home and guzzle a 1/5th of liquor.

Alcoholics have a choice, people with a true disability (epilepsy) do not.

Actually, Gary's point was that if alcoholism is a mental illness, alcoholics don't have a true choice. (No, this does not excuse drunk driving. But it helps to explain why seemingly simple measures don't make people quit.)

You can't rehabilitate yourself out of a disability. Even with extensive physical therapy, a quadriplegic ain't getting up and walking anytime soon. I know several recovering alcoholics. With therapy, guess what? They are fully functioning adults who don't drink, let alone drive drunk. Alcoholism isn't a disability, it's an excuse for making poor choices.

Of course people can be rehabilitated. But to say alcoholism is just an excuse for making poor decisions is complete ignorance, bordering on stupidity.

While I'm always up for a decent debate, I think I've said all I have to say on this topic.

You might as well slap an epileptic in the middle of a seizure and tell them to "stop doing that".

Gary,

I have epilepsy and find your comparison extremely offensive. And, since this something I have experience , the point of having a choice and not has already been introduced.

And, congratulations for people knowing one or two people that are the exception to alcoholism. Go give those drinkers a pat on the back. Just don't take them out to dinner.

I think it would be helpful if whoever declared Louisville a Taxi-free zone would retract that decree. Never seen a city that size where you can't get a damned cab.

There are plenty of cabs in the city. If there is not, they are a phone call away.

Of course people can be rehabilitated.

I don't see any blind, deaf, down, or epileptic people being rehabbed. These are disabilities which people have no choice over, alcoholism is not.

I'm quite sure that those of you worried about your rights being infringed upon would feel differently if it was someone you love who was killed by a drunk driver. I pray none of you have to go through the anguish Dylan's family and my best friend's family have had to go through. If you can look yourself in the eye and say that being inconvenienced at a traffic stop is more of a hardship on you, than losing a family member is to these victim's families, perhaps you're a better person than I.

I'm not just worried about my rights being infringed upon. I am worried about the creeping growth of the busy body, it's for your own good, police state.

On this forum folks are talking about trans fat bans, salt restrictions, forcing restaurants to perform detailed nutritional analyses of their offerings, etc. etc etc. Is this not a slippery slope?

In the case of road blocks, they aren't very effective. Just this morning two people died on Grade Lane in a likely case of DUI. How'd the roadblocks on Frankfort Ave. help them? It's not reasonable to sacrifice probable cause for an intrusive and ineffective enforcement program.

Should we have 100% roadblocks? Should we have cars with breathalyzers that won't start unless you are stone cold sober? If you want to be 100% sure, wouldn't it be reasonable to ban alcohol sales by the glass? If safety is your overwhelming priority, isn't this reasonable?

Life is messy. Many people are stupid or have poor judgment. It's impossible for the Government to protect us from all of them... even totalitarian ones. So, those who say we should allow erosion of our fundamental rights because it's only an inconvenience unless you have done something illegal are totally wrong. Because ultimately, we end up forfeiting our rights for only the illusion of safety.

Justin, seriously... couple years ago it's 1 a.m. on a weekend on Bardstown Road. I figured I'd just walk a block or so and hail the first cab I saw. I could have walked to Taylorsville before I saw one. I'm a prolific user of cabs since they're very cheap compared to death and dismemberment. Louisville is like the suckiest town ever for getting one. Last year I got a barkeeper to call me one but the cab refused to come because my destination was "another bar". WTF? Guess I should have driven.

/Threadjack over

[Robin Garr]

There are plenty of cabs in the city. If there is not, they are a phone call away.

City Scoot!

Justin, seriously... couple years ago it's 1 a.m. on a weekend on Bardstown Road. I figured I'd just walk a block or so and hail the first cab I saw. I could have walked to Taylorsville before I saw one. I'm a prolific user of cabs since they're very cheap compared to death and dismemberment. Louisville is like the suckiest twon ever for getting one. Last year I got a barkeeper to call me one but the cab refused to come because my destination was "another bar". WTF? Guess I should have driven.

/Threadjack over

Yeah, I'm serious. Cabs are easy to get on Bardstown Rd and the 4th St area. They are sparce in the St. Matthews area but usually a 10 minute wait after a phone call. I've never had the bar to bar refusal happen to me.

[Robin Garr]

Should we have cars with breathalyzers that won't start unless you are stone cold sober?

Actually, make that "cars with breathalyzers that won't start if you are clearly impaired," and it's a damn good compromise.

As we talk about rights here, folks, let's bear in mind that driving a car is not a right, it is a privilege, and it's already state-controlled through a state-issued license. There's no legitimate argument that government can't regulate our driving behavior. I don't think anyone here would question that, and none of us would argue that drunks shouldn't drive.

But none of this has to do with whether mass roadblocks are an appropriate way to address the problem. My guess, if all the cops standing around that roadblock had been out patrolling, they probably would have rounded up MORE drunks.

Actually, make that "cars with breathalyzers that won't start if you are clearly impaired," and it's a damn good compromise.

ISort of on the same topic, some of the bars in Nashville have BAC testers for $1 per test. Most people were using them to see who could get the highest "score", but it is still a good idea.

I'm really curious what my BAC is after 2 Hoptimus; I bet I'm pushing the limit, but I drive home.

Well it depends on a whole host of factors - as we all know - but given the right time frame of consumption, I'd have to think you would be pushing the limit.

---

Here's a pet peeve of mine. I'd like to see some restraint on the parts of some bars in regards to going overboard with the high ABV, craft beers on tap. I have not been in there for awhile but Zanzabar sure got my goat last time I visited. It was like high ABV beer after beer on tap. Here I am going down the "tap offerings" thinking, "That's 8%, that's 7ish%, that's 9.5%, that's 9%, etc." Place is packed with young folks consuming these drinks with little care in the world.*

Worse yet, bartenders, at many places, don't even know what they are pouring. Can't tell you the number of times I have asked, "Hey, do you know the ABV on that drink?" and have been told, "Umm, well it's pretty strong I hear." Well, okay then, I'll pass.

Prob one of the reasons I like the true breweries in town. Give you all the information up front. Know what they are talking about. Brew and offer a wide range of beers. Is it really that hard? I know I can get Beak's Best @ 5% at NABC. Altbier at just over 4% at BBC. Sure I am splitting hairs here a bit - (what is the difference between 4, 5, and 6 percent?) - but I would expect a bartender to know a little about a high gravity product he/she is serving. The "craft" beer movement has taken a loose foothold where establishments are more interested in having "X" product than knowing the correct information about "X" product. On one hand, I want to applaud these places for expanding their offerings and giving the customer what he/she wants. On the other hand, a little education and training would be nice.

The simple solution: a responsible offering of "session" beers. Is that too much to ask?

Car breathalyzers do exist are are presently in use.

My guess, if all the cops standing around that roadblock had been out patrolling, they probably would have rounded up MORE drunks.

My guess is there is no way to know for certain.

Oh. I like food.

/ End of threadjack