Tip snuck into bill

here's my personal view on tipping, i tip 15% to 20%. but only when deserved. what i mean by this is, i have a pleasant server. doesn't forget to bring out the silverware when the salads are already presented. or brings out the wrong order etc. and last but not least if they mess up my simple request of NO ICE IN MY COKE, not but once but twice. well then i do adjust my tip. i myself have been in the service industry and believe that a tip is earned and not a given. i have had wonderful servers and a few that were from hell. my uncle frank who was a chef his whole life taught me tipping etiquette. my uncle would always leave a minimum of a 30% tip on the table. i'll never forget one time we eating at a resort many years ago and the bill was like $110.00 he left a $50.00 tip. which i thought was a bit excessive and we argued over it. but my uncle had a heart of gold and lot's of money to throw around. he also taught me when the service is not up to par, one must show that when you leave a tip. this coming from a man that was well respected in his field. funny thing when we walked into an establishment to eat, the staff would fight over who was going to serve us, because they all new he was a generous tipper...

I wonder if there are two sides of the same coin at work with tipping. For me, my standard tip is always a given, unless something goes horribly wrong. I've probably altered my tip negatively in the last 5 years a total of 5 (maybe 10) times. Most of the time such "deductions" were as a result of what seemed a very cognizant choice on the part of the server - providing less-than-expected service because of my younger looks (which were not helped by the even younger looks of my then girlfriend). What a foolish move, as doing so ruined what would have been a great tip from two former servers.

Maybe it's all semantics. But I feel uncomfortable with the "earned" idea behind a tip, as it puts me in this power position over someone who (more times than not) is working very, very hard to gain an income. I'm even forgiving of many, many mistakes and even blatant errors. I try to give everyone the benefit of the doubt.

Maybe this is all laziness on my part. Figuring out 20% is just so much easier than 15%.

Maybe this is all laziness on my part. Figuring out 20% is just so much easier than 15%.

Not to mention calculating 18%...

20% is such a nice round number!

Maybe it's all semantics. But I feel uncomfortable with the "earned" idea behind a tip, as it puts me in this power position over someone who (more times than not) is working very, very hard to gain an income. I'm even forgiving of many, many mistakes and even blatant errors. I try to give everyone the benefit of the doubt.

I agree completely with your forgiving attitude, but I still don't think that changes the basic premise of a tip being earned. If they do consciously drop the ball and obviously don't care that they messed up, or if they're blatantly and inexcusably rude, then I don't believe that they're entitled to a tip. Reducing or withholding a tip because of minor problems is unbelievably cold-hearted, but not reducing the tip in the face of blatant disregard on the part of the server is a too soft.

I do consider myself a good tipper, but would like to be enlightened on the plight of servers.

Average check, tables per hour, tip %, and/or take home pay.

Just a wild guess:


3 tables per hour, 10 hour shift = 30 tables
Average check = $60?
$1800(30 tables @ $60) * 15% = $270

I sure this is way off, but these are the figures that I have in my mind.

The variables (type of restaurant, location, state of the economy, quality of section, etc.) are endless and make this math next to pointless, but...

I find that whenever people do the math, they paint "the best possible picture" of what a sever makes. In other words, I think your picture is of a busy Saturday night, when the economy is strong, and the crowds are in a giving mood. What about the lonely Tuesday? What about the slow lunch shift? Sure, you work those so you can work the busy Saturdays, but the reality of the situation makes that $270 the exception and not the rule.

I agree, but then comes the question of why should the check total effect the tip.
I order a $20 meal and have excellent service and tip 25%. $5.00 tip
I order a $50 meal and have ok service and tip 15%. $7.50 tip

The server that works harder and does a better job gets screwed because they are working at a place that charges less for an entree. There has to be a better way to tip, other than check total alone.

I agree, but then comes the question of why should the check total effect the tip.
I order a $20 meal and have excellent service and tip 25%. $5.00 tip
I order a $50 meal and have ok service and tip 15%. $7.50 tip

The server that works harder and and does a better job gets screwed because they are working at a place that charges less for an entree. There has to be a better way to tip, other than check total alone.

I agree.

The act of tipping based on check total has always frustrated me because while the check total may be a reflection of services rendered (wine presentation, dessert, etc.) it may also be the simple difference between what the patrons ordered. The same server can give the same level of service to two different two-tops, receive the same percentage tip, but end up with a different amount based solely on what the patrons order as an entree.

Alas. Probably the best, yet imperfect, system there is. I try to file this issue under "the law of averages" but I'm still not sure that quality of service rendered should be reflected in check total.

I'm lazy...20% is easy to calculate...and that's a good starting point for good service.

I'm lazy...20% is easy to calculate...and that's a good starting point for good service.

I use the "rule of 5": round up to the next $5 and divide by 5 to calculate the tip. It is easy to compute and works out to about 20%.

I like this story.

Copy of the Bill of Russian Billionaire Roman Abramovich from Nelly’s in New York ($47,000)...

http://www.beersteak.com/breaking-news/bill-russian-billionaire-roman-abramovich-nellys-new-york-47000/

I like this story.

Copy of the Bill of Russian Billionaire Roman Abramovich from Nelly’s in New York ($47,000)...

http://www.beersteak.com/breaking-news/bill-russian-billionaire-roman-abramovich-nellys-new-york-47000/

Gratuity of $7328.20. Nice.

Real nice considering that ~$35,000 of the tab consisted of
opening, decanting, pouring a total of 7 bottles of wine.

Calculating 18% is easy - just triple the tax amount (at least in Kentucky).

And, to beat a dead horse, I, as most posters here, don't mind the automatic gratuity. I just mind NOT BEING TOLD ABOUT IT WHEN THE BILL IS PRESENTED.

It would be interesting to know how many times 38-40% tips result from automatic gratuity policies versus non-automatically added tips. Or, put another way, how many times a 40% tip was INTENDED at an automatic-tip place. My guess is it happens WAY MORE than is intended.

Let me explain a few things:

1. I am a skilled general contractor and carpenter that loves good food. I am also an artist, actor, and musician. Needless to say, I've made my living in the past (like over a decade ago) from tips. I haven't tipped less than 20% since I was 18 years old unless I've had a word with the restaurant manager and the server explaining why I'm doing it. To do otherwise is to be a jerk.

2. Large parties almost always undertip. (How many times have you been with a large party and everyone pitches in for their meal but somehow there's not enough money to pay for the food, much less the tip?) Somehow with large groups $20 on $400 seems reasonable to certain people. My post was aimed at those people. Stay home.

3. Almost all restaurants with decent managers add an automatic gratuity to large parties for the above reason. If you didn't know this already, what are you doing frequenting a restaurant forum?

3. Perhaps noone has griped about tipping in this particular thread but there are a number of you regular posters that whine about tips. It is a recurring theme on this forum and those that have a problem with leaving a proper tip are pathetic. My post was was to you. I stand by what I said, if you're not willing to pay for service stay at home and do it yourself or go to McDonald's where they don't expect tips. If you can afford to eat in a nice restaurant you can afford to tip well. Don't be a Scrooge and don't be a self-centered baby.

4. I was going to add a warning about how a customer with a reputation for being a cheap pain-in-the-ass might be treated by restaurant staff, but I'm sure that none of Louisville's restaurants have employees that might take out their ire a la Fight Club. Instead I'll just say, "Do unto others."

Now I will return to scanning this forum every once in a while. I'll check this thread again in a few days (I prefer to use the forum to find the next restaurant I'm going to try), and if anyone has an argument other than "you've got an ugly tone" I'll respond. I think everything I've written is the truth and sometimes the truth is pretty rude. I only posted in this thread because in the past the defense of tipping servers and staff has been so pathetic from other members. Real foodies tip lavishly. Wannabes gripe about it. If that's rude, well that's fine by me.

Is there a "Real Foodie" secret handshake?

Is there a "Real Foodie" secret handshake?

I'd tell you, but then I'd have to . . .

Is there a "Real Foodie" secret handshake?

I'm not sure, but lately if I had to guess I'd say it involves bludgeoning someone repeatedly on the head while hurling unfounded accusations at them and proclaiming your own superiority. Or was that the secret handshake of the Bush administration? I might have gotten confused...

Don't forget to punch them in the kidneys and yell " Your Tipping History is the mark of your Personality! " .