Poor Service: Point - Counterpoint

Bare feet on the chair ???...In a restaurant ??? How positively tacky. Sounds like someone's mommy may have neglected to give them the "appropriate restaurant behavior" speech when they were a child.

Man, I could go on and on about this one....

I do know that Maido has a problem with flies. I also know for a fact that they have tried everything to get rid of them. Well, everything in their power. So, it really sucks, but those of us who choose to enjoy food and drink on that patio at this time of year are informed about it, and we have to make the choice. Usually, I choose to eat outside and wave the flies away every minute or two. It's just worth it to me. So I don't hold it against them.

please do alan, i would love to hear about it.

Me too...me too.

(NOTE: Remember all those <eh-hem> "interesting" people you saw at the State Fair last month ? Well I'm out in Oklahoma City right now and guess what ? The same crowd is now out here for the Oklahoma State Fair...albeit sporting a few more pounds and a few less teeth. Oh and guess what ? They are all staying at my freaking hotel....So go ahead Alan (etc) throw a little humor our way. I need it bad.)

As is the case with any story (but especially the case of a story re-told in cyberspace) the "truth" of what happened is living somewhere between David's story and Courtenay's story. Being that we are all food people and customers, I do think there's a tendency to side with the person who has received "poor" service. For that reason, I respect Courtenay for coming here and giving her side of things. That being said, I could have done without the "if you were offended, I apologize" apology. Just because presidents, football coaches, and other famous people resort to such tactics, that doesn't mean when need such insincerity within our community.

On a somewhat related point, I don't think it is fair to post a negative review of the service received at an establishment or offer advice on practices at a particular establishment if you choose not to speak up when poor service occurs. While I don't see it as the server being called out in public (no identity was given), I don't think the server should have to come back days later and defend her actions. This conversation should have happened with the manager when the situation occurred. To come here and "break the news" seems as insincere as the fake apology Courtenay offered. I do see Jessie's point that the manager might have been the one pushing the server to get the customer out the door - if David had approached the manager and the manager had been disrespectful to him, he would have a much stronger argument in my opinion.

it sounds like she's offended as we all have right to be when publicly attacked.

Hey, she wasn't publicly attacked - no one knew it was her until she responded. Just sayin'.

What Marsha said.

Shame on both of you for nit-picking and missing the point. It WAS an attack in my opinion, as I clearly recall managing a restaurant that was mentioned for poor service in a thread, no names were mentioned, but a quick investigation overturned the identity of the server. Surly you can appreciate that (potential employment sabotage is not an attack???) and not feel the need quote me and criticize me again for standing up in defense of a personal friend. "Just sayin".

Amen! Shame on you for nit -picking. And nastiness. Unbelievable.

I generally like this forum. I love food and I love talking and writing about food. It's my business and I love doing business here in Louisville. Yet some of the responses here got my eyes a rollin'. "We'll, I WILL NEVER go there again..." Over this? Gimme a break. I quoted a couple of things here...

I think Courtney is getting an unfair response. I know her personally and she's been in this business much much longer than anyone here has been posting on Hotbytes. She's intelligent, creative, and gracious, and it sounds like she's offended as we all have right to be when publicly attacked.

First I need to admit that I too have known Courtenay for a long time and agree with the above statement. Yet, I would disagree with her coming onto this forum to debate about it. Why? Because a) it only eviscerates the problem b) the tone is easily misinterpreted here and c) David's initial post is frustrating to me and to respond only sinks yourself down to that level. Frustrating? Yes. If it would have been 5 or 6 years ago I would have said childish. But internet culture is so mainstream now is guess "everyone's doing it" and its no longer in the realms of teenagers so here we are.

You take this issue up with management immediately not huff and puff about it then type up a damaging response on a public internet forum. That or you don't leave a tip and then explain to the server why. That will get the message across believe me. But David, this looks silly. Plus, the "industry" would have taught you that visiting upscale restaurants 30 minutes before closing should be avoided. You should know better. Service, food quality, everything suffers at that time. And this happens EVERYWHERE. And if you are worried about contempt from a server, then maybe next time you go to a place just before closing and put a microphone inside the kitchen and take a listen to what THEY think. OMG.

On a somewhat related point, I don't think it is fair to post a negative review of the service received at an establishment or offer advice on practices at a particular establishment if you choose not to speak up when poor service occurs.

This.

This conversation should have happened with the manager when the situation occurred.

Yes!

My wife and I dined recently at a relatively new establishment in Louisville. It was our first time. There were some issues. The first stab at her meal came out wrong, and the kitchen had to do it again. The server threw the kitchen staff under the bus, and it was tacky the way it was handled. But my meal was fine, and so was hers after it was redone.

Moral of the story: It was no biggie, and not worth the comment. We'll be back. We live in an imperfect world. No matter what it is being debated in this particular thread, there are matters of far weightier significance.

The worst experience I ever had in an eatery was my own fault, because I was in a hurry and my wife called to suggest that she stop in Taco Bell and pick something up. I said yes. Half an hour later, she arrived flustered and foodless because of a mix-up at the drive-through window where the computer had failed, leaving people stranded in line, immovable, for all that time. The manager's response to her complaint was dismissive and abrasive.

I'd had a couple beers, not the best time for action, but nonetheless she drove me back there and I launched in on the manager, who was a punk of about 25. He proceeded to tell me that it wasn't his fault -- it was the computer, and that his job was to protect his crew from people like me, and that he didn't care who I was or whether I owned a restaurant. And: I could be as macho as I wished to be but his weekly sales performance was such that there was no way Taco Bell would fire him because a competitor would snap him right up ... and furthermore, company statistics showed that each day, 2 point something percent of the customers are unhappy wth their visits, and although most of them will come back, anyway, the ones who won't (like us) are a mere statistical anomaly well within his margin of error.

Finally, he informed me that the only reason I had come there to complain was that I was trying to look important in front of my female companion.

The whole time, a crowd of about 15 high school kids stood and watched. I looked at them, and at the same aged kids behind the counter. And I knew that I was conclusively, totally beaten. I had not hit so much as a loud foul.

And: There was no way to win. The kid was absolutely right on almost every count, and the few upon which he wasn't were, indeed, within the margin of error. Folks, THAT's a bad experience. But it's the world as it is, now, in this time. That's corporate America as it is, now, in this time. That's what we've stooped to being as a nation. Compared to that, and compared to the symbolism of my defeat, nothing can ever happen to me elsewhere worthy of note. I am serene (only partially a fabrication -- I'm more serene than I used to be).

Maido is an independent, and the people there do great things. Nothing about this thread will discourage me from touting and visiting Maido at every opportunity. I hope most of you do the same. This is not to be considered an abasement of the original poster. There's enough sincerity to go around. I just get the impression that there's an absence of perspective here.

I have worked with Courtenay and have had her wait on me at Maido and she is an asset to any restaurant. Although I have seen others resolve issues with restaurant problems on this site, I think this forum is to have open discussions about good AND bad dining experiences and should not be used as as a tool to try to resolve the problems here. If one really has a problem at a place, the issue should be resolved at that time not in a public forum. Thus, I think it is okay for Courtenay to speak her mind just like anyone else does and share her side of the story without sugar coating it and kissing someone's a**!

Maido is an independent, and the people there do great things. Nothing about this thread will discourage me from touting and visiting Maido at every opportunity. I hope most of you do the same. This is not to be considered an abasement of the original poster. There's enough sincerity to go around. I just get the impression that there's an absence of perspective here.

Bravo Roger, well said. Thank you.

Below is a letter that was published in this weeks Leo. Coincidentally, It is a good way to reflect on this forum.

Think Before Venting

We Americans are an impulsive people. If a thought — any thought — pops into our minds, we must share it spontaneously. Our collective attention span is dangerously short. Oh, we might forget, so let’s get it out on the table. Now!

Vent! Vent! Vent! Venting is very good for the soul of America, but very bad for the one maligned. Talk radio equals ranting — a national pastime. Town hall meetings equal shouting — a national disgrace.

But, pray tell, what is the quality of our messages? Stop for one refreshingly brief moment and consider: Will my words hurt or harm? Will they be misunderstood? Am I speaking to befriend or belittle or to put myself on a pedestal? Can my impulsive words wait — at least while they undergo one good revision? Are my words simply hot air enflaming an already red-hot public discourse with all talk and no listening?

Or, quite possibly, is what I am about to utter the rarest of rarities: thoughtful remarks meant to enlighten and inform while remaining civil?

Ron Cooper, Hikes Point
Copied from http://leoweekly.com/news/inbox-%E2%80%94-sept-16-2009

[Robin Garr]

the rarest of rarities: thoughtful remarks meant to enlighten and inform while remaining civil

Courtenay, this forum is at its best when we manage that. Sometimes we miss the mark, sometimes we hit the mark, but it's always worth a try.

Welcome to our community, by the way. I hope you'll stay after we've chewed all the flavor out of this topic.

I just want to make a few thing clear here. My intent in my post was to respond to David. I spoke with the owner before I posted it, and we agreed that it was my voice, not Maidos’s. So no, I will not be fired for this. My job depends on my job performance, which has been most satisfactory in the owner’s and customers eyes. I love my job and am good at it.

There are two points I gather from this statement. Talking to management would have not done David any good because they feel the customer was wrong and their employee was right if they are supporting your "apology". Secondly, David doesn't feel your performance was satisfactory.

I really don't care either way. It just seems strange that Maido is taking this stance with a unhappy customer.

I see your point Justin. That kinda goes with the customer is always right kinda mentality. However I believe that when you work somewhere as small as Maido for an extended period of time that you develop close relationships with your coworkers, and you it only make sense that you have their backs. If merited. I think the owner/management can make an educated decision of how they want to perceive the situation based on the record that the employee holds. I say that because I have worked there for nearly 3 years without complaint.I deal with alot of really difficult situations there, and with grace. I really do a good job there. They know that, and I can be trusted at my workplace. Its nice to know that your employer will not throw you under the bus when a rare accusation is thrown at you. Again, I am not speaking for the owners of Maido. This is my opinion. Lets face it. Maybe the customer isn't always right? Also right and wrong are in the eye of the beholder. And once more, no one should have to put up with or submit to unwarranted rudeness. kitchen, customer, owner, manager, dishwasher. no one. Having said that, I do believe that perception is key in these matters.

Also it is not an apology. I don't think i ever said that word? I know I know. I said sorry. Maybe should have re-worded that. I am learning that about these threads. Your words go through some serious dissection.

Shame on both of you for nit-picking and missing the point. It WAS an attack in my opinion, as I clearly recall managing a restaurant that was mentioned for poor service in a thread, no names were mentioned, but a quick investigation overturned the identity of the server. Surly you can appreciate that (potential employment sabotage is not an attack???) and not feel the need quote me and criticize me again for standing up in defense of a personal friend. "Just sayin".

I understand and appreciate and even respect your opinion in this matter...but I'm afraid we're going to have to leave it at. I'm still of the opinion that Marsha was correct in her interpretation.

What I do regret is my original post where I stated "fire the b****". That comment was made prior to the "other side of the story" becoming known and very likely under the influence of some high end KY bourbon. I have edited my previous post to temper this statement.