Advertising

Just a couple of things..

With everyone advocating 'buy local' why wouldn't you want t do the same with your advertising? Louisville HotBytes is local and has a market focused on FOOD AND DINING IN LOUISVILLE. When people are here on the site they are activley looking for food and dining info. Granted, it works best if you have a website that your ad can click through to but if you do then you are in a great position to steer folks to your site. The site gets more that 150,000 hits a month. That's a lot of eyes folks and all of them interested in food.

Second...
Distribution (the number of papers/magazines put out on the street) numbers are only part of the equation. The real number should be looking at is the readership numbers. What difference how many papers are put out there if half of them are returned and trashed? In the past when I tried to find readership numbers for Velocity (from the usual market suppliers of that kind of information), I could never get a definitive answer. They seemed to lump their readership in with sections of the CJ and I could never get a real readership number just for Velocity. If it's a good number why hide it under smoke and mirrors? Velocity never reports on their pick up rate(meaning, the number of papers that are picked up at the end of their publishing week when the new issues are put out.) Ask yourself which is more impressive - put out 100,000 papers a week and have less than 1% returned or put out 200,000 papers a week and have 75% returned? (BTW I use these numbers are only to illustrate that you have to look at the whole equation to get the full picture but I think you catch my meaning.)

I have been on this site hundreds of times and couldn't tell you a single advertiser because I either don't notice, don't care to notice, or whatever the case. So these numbers are murky as well. On-line publicity is still tricky business as the new model of information (i.e. internet) gets ironed out. As for written press such as Velocity, it is hard to ascertain how many people pick up the same free copy that sits on a table for a week or two. I'm sure each industry has its ways of presenting the numbers in their favor.

[Robin Garr]

I have been on this site hundreds of times and couldn't tell you a single advertiser because I either don't notice, don't care to notice, or whatever the case. So these numbers are murky as well. On-line publicity is still tricky business as the new model of information (i.e. internet) gets ironed out. As for written press such as Velocity, it is hard to ascertain how many people pick up the same free copy that sits on a table for a week or two. I'm sure each industry has its ways of presenting the numbers in their favor.

The advantage to independent local restaurants in advertising on this site is that they get displayed both on the forum and on the LouisvilleHotBytes reviews/news pages, which together reach a very large percentage of local restaurant business people and "foodies" in a concentrated mass, with little or no "waste" as you get with the CJ, where only a tiny fraction of its diminishing corps of real readers have any interest in the restaurant ad. (Can anyone confirm, by the way, that the CJ counts both Web visitors and those awful little green throwaway papers within their numbers when they quote circulation to potential advertisers?)

Compare the price. Compare the impact. It simply doesn't make economic sense for a local food or drink business to choose the CJ over LouisvilleHotBytes.

It depends on the genre but I'll use a casual place wanting carry out business for example. This is just my opinion though and my experience is nothing like some of the folks on here. But I'm gonna give it shot.

Mailers. Mail your menu/carry out menu out to everyone in the zipcode with an attached coupon. Make it easy to read hours of operation, the phone number, and location. Let people know you are there and that you want them to come in.

Get a website. Again make it easy to find the phone number, hours of operation, and location. It drives me nuts when restaurants neglect this.

Keep the food simple and memorable. People will spread the word like wildfire if you bring the awesome.

I have been on this site hundreds of times and couldn't tell you a single advertiser because I either don't notice, don't care to notice, or whatever the case. So these numbers are murky as well. On-line publicity is still tricky business as the new model of information (i.e. internet) gets ironed out. As for written press such as Velocity, it is hard to ascertain how many people pick up the same free copy that sits on a table for a week or two. I'm sure each industry has its ways of presenting the numbers in their favor.

The advantage to independent local restaurants in advertising on this site is that they get displayed both on the forum and on the LouisvilleHotBytes reviews/news pages, which together reach a very large percentage of local restaurant business people and "foodies" in a concentrated mass, with little or no "waste" as you get with the CJ, where only a tiny fraction of its diminishing corps of real readers have any interest in the restaurant ad. (Can anyone confirm, by the way, that the CJ counts both Web visitors and those awful little green throwaway papers within their numbers when they quote circulation to potential advertisers?)

Compare the price. Compare the impact. It simply doesn't make economic sense for a local food or drink business to choose the CJ over LouisvilleHotBytes.

Robin,
I figured I'd hear from you (as I reflected over lunch)......I'm not arguing against hotbytes. It is probably the most obvious website venue for ads. I'm just stating that web hits can be misleading. Heck, I probably account for 200 hits per month just myself! I'm also stating that unless you get a big front page ad on Yahoo's home page it gets tricky as to how customers are routed to ads and whether or not they pay attention to them. I guess the irony is that Velocity is nothing but an ad magazine--that is all I do with it essentially is just flip thru to see the restaurant and other ads.

[Robin Garr]

James, you are correct that the forum (and popular forums in general) get a lot of repeat visitors. Again, though, ads here run on the forum and on the main HotBytes pages, and when our reps talk with potential advertisers, they supply more statistics than duplicated visits. Bottom line, we can brag about a couple of million page impressions ("hits" being something else, not really relevant in this discussion), but the real key criteria are how many different people see an ad, AND how much of that traffic is wasted on people who aren't reading the publication with any interest in food, drink and dining. Here, essentially 100 percent of the traffic is focused, and the "unduplicated" traffic is non-trivial.

A big front page on Yahoo (or any other national site) would make no sense for a small Louisville business, because a very large share of the advertising dollar would be wasted.

I figured I'd hear from you (as I reflected over lunch)......I'm not arguing against hotbytes. It is probably the most obvious website venue for ads. I'm just stating that web hits can be misleading. Heck, I probably account for 200 hits per month just myself! I'm also stating that unless you get a big front page ad on Yahoo's home page it gets tricky as to how customers are routed to ads and whether or not they pay attention to them. I guess the irony is that Velocity is nothing but an ad magazine--that is all I do with it essentially is just flip thru to see the restaurant and other ads.

The DINING WITH STEVE! Show - of course!!!

I've actually been loving "Dining with Steve". Has anyone else been watching it? I haven't even availed myself of any coupons. I just love how genuine Steve seems, and I love his little personal segment/rant in the middle (often his personal movie reviews).

I'll bet a lot of people watch it.

Thanks Marsha! I wish we could get more local/indies on the show - that's really
what we're all about - giving them an affordable way to be on TV.

And you're right - Steve's a hoot! He's really shy in person, but put him in front of a camera
and off he goes - he's got a great sense of humor, and laughs at himself more than anything.
He's a good guy...and very funny

I've actually been loving "Dining with Steve". Has anyone else been watching it? I haven't even availed myself of any coupons. I just love how genuine Steve seems, and I love his little personal segment/rant in the middle (often his personal movie reviews).

I'll bet a lot of people watch it.

Bob,

I will say that I was told by one casual dining restaurant owner out in Lagrange that "Dining with Steve" was very good for increasing their traffic. ( Personally I've never watched it).
Deb

James, you are correct that the forum (and popular forums in general) get a lot of repeat visitors. Again, though, ads here run on the forum and on the main HotBytes pages, and when our reps talk with potential advertisers, they supply more statistics than duplicated visits. Bottom line, we can brag about a couple of million page impressions ("hits" being something else, not really relevant in this discussion), but the real key criteria are how many different people see an ad, AND how much of that traffic is wasted on people who aren't reading the publication with any interest in food, drink and dining. Here, essentially 100 percent of the traffic is focused, and the "unduplicated" traffic is non-trivial.

A big front page on Yahoo (or any other national site) would make no sense for a small Louisville business, because a very large share of the advertising dollar would be wasted.

Robin,
You made your case.......And I'm not suggesting anyone from Louisville should pay for a Yahoo ad. I'm just citing Yahoo as an ultimate web ad in general.

Hotbytes of course! And try the Town Planner, that quaint calender with old louisville pictures, coupons on every page, and people really do hang it up in the house. Besides that, word of mouth is hard to beat. We have a line to the door every day of the week and that is from word of mouth, good food, and the kind reviews of Robin and others. Try to get on Secrets of Louisville Chefs, got a huge response from the show. Also have a fan write the paper for a recipe from Ron. Just a couple of ideas. Bill

Thanks to ALL ----you all are something .

I'm still not sold on Facebook, Twitter, etc. etc., but at the least, all restaurants should have a basic website (and to those that take reservations, use Open Table, please).

Brad -

I have read a number of complaints about Open Table on this Forum, though they seem to be targeted at restaurants that block off seatings. I have spoken with them and my question is "Will Louisville residents use this service to book reservations at locations beyond Jefferson County?" What's your opinion?

I like Open Table from the few times I've used it. I really like Urban Spoon - there are photos, maps, reviews and they have that slot machine selector thing that really is useful.
iPhone user

Bob -

I have used many of the suggestions and would be happy to relate my overall thoughts about any of them. Just send me a PM with your contact info if you want to talk.

What you haven't said is what end result are you looking for by advertising. I am not familiar with you so, is this a new place that is looking for exposure or have you been around for some time and are looking to grow your number of core guests? If you are new, return on your expense may not be that important...just increased traffic and exposure. If you have been around, things are probably different. Not to pick on any one suggestion, but as an example look at the Family Savings Magazine (there are several of these style publications). Your ad will be around $400 to $500 for a bi-monthly publication which will provide a worthwhile discount coupon(s). At your reduced profit margin, how many more guests will you need to serve to cover your initial marketing investment. Most important, have you really won over new repeat guests?