New York Style Bagels

I don't hate the bagels at Whole Foods, but the plain tend to go quickly. Nowhere near as good as my beloved H&H, but it fills the occasional craving.

[Robin Garr]

Hmm, guess I'm the only person who doesn't give a flip about the "authenticity" of my bagel. I consider it a comfort food, and something I splurge on if I'm in the mood.

So, Adrian, do you feel the same way in the pizza wars?

I don't know. I hear you, and if any round bread with a hole in the middle that isn't a donut works as a bagel for you, more power to you.

But to me, having known NYC bagels when I was a kid, there's a comfort-food issue that comes from a more specific memory of a chewy, crusty, slightly sweet whiteflour character that's unique to a "real" bagel, and substitutes that remind me of hamburger buns with a hole fall decidedly short.

No question that individual mileage may vary, but personally, I'm much more of a seeker for the real thing in bagels than I am even for pizza. (Heck, a NYC pizza is significantly evolved from Italian pizza, so there. )

i'm not saying these are new york style bagels, but since the bagel shops are shrinking here in louisville what about panera bread and their bagels? also does einstein bagels still exist here.

No Einstein in Louisville that I know of. I have picked up bagels on occasion at the Einstein's in the then-Delta concourse at Detroit airport and wasn't overly impressed.

I'm not being anti-chain here, but specifically critical: Panera's breads in general have never impressed me, and I would never even have dreamed of trying a "bagel" there. Do they make any claim to authenticity? I get a bad vibe from Panera because they promote "bread fresh baked daily" when it's no secret that they actually ship in parbaked loaves from a commissary in St. Louis. This process can yield decent bread, but when they lead with a lie, it bothers me.

"Our bakers work through the night, shaping and scoring the dough by hand, to bring you fresh-baked bread every morning and throughout the day. All Panera breads are made from only the freshest dough using our own recipes and only unbleached flour."

Uh huh.

Robin,

That would be called "marketing". Technically, it's true...

Deb

[Robin Garr]

fresh market used to carry H&H bagels from nyc. yum. but not no more...

Frozen? Bagels baked in the morning need to be sold by noon ...

Well there are real NYC style bagels and then there are bread wheels. Nothing wrong with bread wheels, but they just ain't NYC bagels.

I love all types of 'good' pizza. I love an authentic slice of NY Pizza as much as anyone, it's my favorite style...

...but say, Danny Mac's isn't "authentic" anything, and I would assume isn't trying to be. It's just damn good pizza.

I'd guess most of your bagel shops around here haven't given one thought as to trying to be "Authentic New York" style, they just wanna make a good bagel.

Every food originated SOMEWHERE, and said food usually duplicated all over the world, sometimes great, sometimes not so great.

But sometimes good food is just good food. I don't understand why a circlular boiled piece of bread has to be "authentic New York" to be tasty or enjoyed. or considered edible.

I'd guess most of your bagel shops around here haven't given one thought as to trying to be "Authentic New York" style, they just wanna make a good bagel.

I suspect you may be correct on this point, but perhaps someone out there should give it a go.

A good bagel, or at least a bagel that I find good, NYC or otherwise, should be dense, chewy with a shiny "crusty" outside and a very slight sweet flavor. So have you found any that meet these criteria? I have not, and thus the point of my post since I'm a relative newcomer to the area.

Bill

[Robin Garr]

But sometimes good food is just good food. I don't understand why a circlular boiled piece of bread has to be "authentic New York" to be tasty or enjoyed. or considered edible.

Well, Bill P just gave a good description that wins my "+1", but let's get one thing clear - well, two things - so we don't go off the rails the way these discussions sometimes do.

1. FOR ME, real NYC bagels are a childhood pleasure, and a variation that departs much from the original lacks that pleasure quotient for me.

2. Others' mileage may vary, and I'm okay with that. I am NOT saying that people who disagree with me are ignorant, devoid of taste, or in any other way defective.

When I review bagels, I'm going to express my preference, but I'll also make clear what my preference is. And if a restaurant (Nancy's, for example), professes to serve a New York-style bagel, then they open the door to legitimate critical analysis.

Fair enough? I don't want to be a bagel snob here, but childhood pleasures are what they are. Same goes for pizza, I guess. I do like Danny Mac's, and Impellizzeri's, too, and Boombozz. But for deep-down comfort, give me a NYC slice or even an authentic Neapolitan-style pie.

Maybe so, but it's been my experience in arguments w/ New Yorkers that when it comes to pizza/bagels, you'll NEVER be able to replicate the true NY Taste/experience b/c of the famous "New York Water" variable no matter how hard you try...

...So, seems like a lost cause sometimes.

I'm not sure that argument holds water.

[Robin Garr]

Maybe so, but it's been my experience in arguments w/ New Yorkers that when it comes to pizza/bagels, you'll NEVER be able to replicate the true NY Taste/experience b/c of the famous "New York Water" variable no matter how hard you try...

...So, seems like a lost cause sometimes.

I like Bill P's response!

And no, that's not where I'm coming from. I think it's entirely possible to come up with a respectable bagel in the NYC style anywhere. Heck, Sid's used to do it. We played a trick on a friend who was a NYC bagel snob one time - brought back a Second Avenue Deli bag, stuffed 'em with Sid's poppyseed, and presented them to her with great ceremony. She loved them, and was heard to chortle, "You just can't make a New York bagel anywhere else."

^ I'd like to see how yourself, and many others would fare in a similar trick w/ Dooley's or one of the 'better' Bagels from around town.

I'll give Dooly's a try next time I cross the river and report back.

[Robin Garr]

^ I'd like to see how yourself, and many others would fare in a similar trick w/ Dooley's or one of the 'better' Bagels from around town.

I'm pretty sure it wouldn't be hard to tell, Adrian, although I wouldn't bet BIG money on myself.

But it's sort of like a wine geek, who might very well mix up a Cabernet Sauvignon and a Pinot Noir, but probably wouldn't have much trouble distinguishing either from Manischewitz. And I am not saying that Manischewitz is a bad wine, only that it has a distinctly different style.

Robin, are you sure that the 2nd Ave. Deli made their own bagels? They're kind of an afterthought on the menu, and I always thought their reputation was made on their deli meats. One of the relatives of Abe Lebewohl who owns the place now owned a bagel store chain, but...

Of course, the 2nd Ave. Deli isn't on 2nd Avenue any more.