A Foodies Rant

A long time ago, 10 years or so, I came home to Louisville from living in Nashville for almost 20 years. When I returned home I discovered this wonderful blog site, Louisville HotBytes! I was all over it, and because of it I've made many wonderful friends who share my love and passion for the Louisville Food Scene! Long story short, I love this site, and it has gotten me thru some very rough times in my life.

Now, the blog is still here, although the general attitude has been more toward to beating down, overtly berating, and bringing down the good that we have here in town. Now I am not saying that we, as individuals, are not entitled to our opinions; and lord knows I have mine and have shared them freely over the years. And Robin has graciously allowed some of my opinion to be posted, even though it caught some "heated debate", for which I am grateful.

HOWEVER, there are those here who take great pleasure in find fault with everything that has been posted with no malice. A simple announcement becomes a free-for-all of conjecture and slanted opinion.

When I originally joined this blog, it was fun, informative, informational, and a means to "Meat & Eat" with like minded folks. As I stated, I have made many new friends on here which I cherish greatly.

My point of this rant is this: There are those of us who appreciate creativity, originality and the incredible inspiration it takes to get ahead in this crazy food market we are lucky to live in. If you can't appreciate that fact, and respect what goes on "in the back of the house", and want to find fault because a bar stool doesn't hit your back properly or the like, then please think before you post. Additionally, I know that Vegan and Vegetarian is a necessary evil (I say that as a life long meat-eater), and I applaud those who make allowances and concessions for these folks, not everyone is of that like mindset. Asking a chef to leave a meat product out of a stock (that has probably been on the back burner of the stove all day) may seem reasonable to you, but put yourself in the shoes of that chef. My view has changed vastly since I have a roommate who is an Executive Chef at one of the best places (yet again, my opinion) in town, and I consistently hear him complain about strange ticket requests, and the like. Yes, the customer should come first---no argument! But the customer should also realize what hoops the back of the house must go thru for those special requests.

Chefs spend countless hours trying to anticipate the wants, needs and loves of their customers. Asking to change the menu items not only frustrates them, it slows down the productivity in the kitchen, hence it will delay service of your meal. I also know for a fact that some recent posts have not set well with some owners/chefs and have caused them some pause in their approach when, in my opinion, it was not warranted.

Now, there are some wonderful places in town that will go out of their way to accommodate non-menu requests, and for them I tip my hat. As a foodie, I take the chefs menu as law and run with it. As a result, I am happy to say I have discovered many items that I would not have tried before, and I do enjoy them now.

Let's keep this forum fun, informative and enlightening. Please think before you post.

And finally, I wish you all Good Eating in the Derby City at this crazy, fun, and horsey time of the year! Plus, thank you for listening to my rant!

[Robin Garr]

Asking a chef to leave a meat product out of a stock (that has probably been on the back burner of the stove all day) may seem reasonable to you ...

Was that posted on the forum, Bill? I don't remember it. Link?

Robin, no, but I have heard that request while dining out....and I took the liberty of explaining to the requestor what goes into the creation of the stocks...they did thank me for the info, and didn't realize how complex the process was.

[Robin Garr]

Robin, no, but I have heard that request while dining out....and I took the liberty of explaining to the requestor what goes into the creation of the stocks...they did thank me for the info, and didn't realize how complex the process was.

Gotcha! I'm glad I misunderstood. I thought you were citing examples of the Decline and Fall of the Forum.

Hi Bill,
I'd written a response to your post yesterday while waiting for time to go to the Bourbon Society meeting. When it was time to leave I decided not to post it for a couple of reasons.

First, I whipped it out very quickly and wasn't sure it reflected what I wanted to say.

Second, I wanted to see what other responses your post might elicit from others more qualified or less confused by some of the things you mentioned than I.

I've obviously decided to respond to your post and this is prompted by a rather bizarre incident that occurred to me last night after the meeting that made me think that one of my own conclusions about the Hotbytes Forum might need adjusting.

I have long thought that few industry insiders (e.g. chefs, owners, managers, cooks, wait staff) actually read Hotbytes or took it very seriously if they did. Your comments and something that happened last night make me wonder if more insiders do read it and take it seriously than I thought.

I won't describe the event that occurred last night in detail out of respect for the other person involved. Let's just say an industry insider recognized me in a bar and referenced an old series of posts (of mine) concerning a restaurant he works at.

Our conversation started out quite amiably, complementary even with this person stating that my posts resulted in some positive affect at his restaurant. I was stunned by this. I had never met this person but he definitely knew me. As our conversation continued he asked my why I hadn't been in lately.

Things seemed to go progressively down hill from there. This person became more and more critical of me. I would say irrational even to the point of deriding my beer selection. The bar tender got involved at that point and things devolved even further.

In the space of twenty minutes our relationship went from him insisting that he take me to his favorite bar after we finished our drinks to several more disparaging remarks and his abrupt departure. He returned after a few minutes, apologized then departed (without renewing his invitation).

I wondered if this person harbored resentment because of what I wrote that he didn't want to admit or if he was just one of those people who can't disagree with someone without becoming angry. I'll probably never know that but what I'm pretty sure of is that some industry insiders read Hotbyte posts and take them seriously.

I tried to explain to him that when I post, from my point of view, I'm merely talking to a lot of people I know to varying degrees much as I would if we were sitting at the bar together. He said that what we post has more impact than that. I immediately thought of your post when he said that.

In any case, it seems like a conversation worth having and I'd like to hear from more industry people on the subject. Cheers Bill!

Robin, no, but I have heard that request while dining out....and I took the liberty of explaining to the requestor what goes into the creation of the stocks...they did thank me for the info, and didn't realize how complex the process was.

Gotcha! I'm glad I misunderstood. I thought you were citing examples of the Decline and Fall of the Forum.

There is no such thing as a 'decline and fall' of this forum in my opinion. This thing breathes- it evolves. I've been on the soapbox for more industry involvement for years...

The truth be told, the industry folk are scared to death to post here- for fear that they will get into an argument and alienate potential guests.

They still come here, almost religiously, and read- wishing they could post thier opinions, but not being able to. Robin doesn't need to monitor this- as forumites, we kind of have to.

Any thread can be stomped. The greatest of intentions can become the worst of nightmares. I wrote a piece about Mussel's that got stomped by a troll. I had to write a clarification over some silliness. It took me two hours on that whole affair, when all I wanted to do was say 'they're doing good work and here's why.' He invested 2-4 sentences, about 3 minutes.

I'm pretty sure the mortgage broker or the retired 'P.I.' have no fiscal involvement in being a jerk. They come here to make themselves happy by belittling others. That by some stretch of the imagination, people will like them because they 'tell it like it is.'

To the restaurant folk- this is our lives, food in our children's bellies. Not just pretty words on a page.

It's a mix of not wanting to alienate potential guests and the fear of repercussion from any current employer. I can't exactly rip into a forum member I find ridiculous for danger of making my employer look bad. Such is the problem these days with social media in regard to employment. That's why I never even allude to where I work or the practices of that restaurant.

A lot of industry people use this site to promote their place of business but I find that doesn't really give them the freedom to say what they'd like when industry negatives are discussed.

Stephen, I respect your position. Your way might be the correct path.

But when I read about the trials of people who can't get a coke with no ice... the tribulations of those who didn't go to high school here... or face the reality that I don't give a shit about the craft beer movement... well... I guess sometimes I feel like I'm better off biting my tongue.

*ETA - I was responding to a post that was apparently no longer exists.

I hope that the folks in the biz do know for every one of the ones out there that just want to mouth off and cause trouble there are folks like me that in the years since I have joined I have gained a whole new respect for all positions in the food service industry. I no longer complain unless absolutely necessary and when I do I do not accept free meals or the like that is not what I want. I tip better and I understand more what goes on thanks to all of you. I also frequent more independent places not only restaurants but stores as well. Just Thank You and keep doing what you are doing you are appreciated.

Stephen, I respect your position. Your way might be the correct path.

But when I read about the trials of people who can't get a coke with no ice... the tribulations of those who didn't go to high school here... or face the reality that I don't give a shit about the craft beer movement... well... I guess sometimes I feel like I'm better off biting my tongue.

*ETA - I was responding to a post that was apparently no longer exists.

Yup. Life is turribul hard for them folks.

Actually, since I am no longer in the biz in anyway shape or fashion, I prefer to use the site to share my positive experiences since I don't always have time to compliment a chef or owner after a meal. I also love getting cooking tips from people that really know how to cook. I can't count the times I've come to this site with some sort of cooking question and gotten great ideas and advice from some fine chefs. I consider it a GRAND gift for them to take time out of their busy schedule to offer their help. How cool is that?! Where else could I do that?

Yeah so a big thank you to all you industry people that do read LHB and take the time to post.

I'm in the industry, I come here to post kudos to restaurants where I've had a great time, (hopefully) constructive criticism to those who have provided a less than spectacular experience, and to address issue that pertain to the body of restaurants I represent.

For the latter, do I have to be extremely careful and PC? Of course. Can I openly vent frustrations? Only if I am very careful. Do I want to alienate existing and potential customers? Of course not. So when I post here about the state of the industry or J. Gumbo's stuff in particular, I try to post no differently than I would if I were speaking to a guest at one of our restaurants. This requires the occasional "business face," but since I detest "business face" I try to temper that with some real "human face," as we industry folks are real people and we have the same joys and frustrations non-industry folk do. (If you cut us, do we not bleed (one of the 5 mother sauces?)) It's a fine line to toe, but it's not impossible to be both professional and human.

Stephen, I respect your position. Your way might be the correct path.

But when I read about the trials of people who can't get a coke with no ice... the tribulations of those who didn't go to high school here... or face the reality that I don't give a shit about the craft beer movement... well... I guess sometimes I feel like I'm better off biting my tongue.

*ETA - I was responding to a post that was apparently no longer exists.

I didn't know you were watching!

I ran through my normal checks- spelling, syntax, respect. I was good with all of that, There was one exception: topicallity. We can't encourage a sense of community if we are constantly in debate amongst ourselves over some silliness. Your approach is different than mine- cool. I need to keep my fat mouth shut and let you get your coppers in.

You saw it- maybe a couple of others too. My post was very kind and respectful. I just thought that I had underminined the entire premise of this thread.

So those words 'had to go.'

," (If you cut us, do we not bleed (one of the 5 mother sauces?)) .

ROTFLMAO!!!

Now, there are some wonderful places in town that will go out of their way to accommodate non-menu requests, and for them I tip my hat. As a foodie, I take the chefs menu as law and run with it. As a result, I am happy to say I have discovered many items that I would not have tried before, and I do enjoy them now.

I never questioned my mother's menus, and that's pretty much the way I am in restaurants. A friend from the Netherlands visited Louisville a few years ago, and wanted to order a Hot Brown sans Mornay. That's fine I guess, and the Talbott tavern accommodated, but I had a hard time with it.